[ Closed ] Solidoodle Business Ethics (Page 1 of 2)

Aside from the "legality" or "illegality" of it all, what I don't understand is where you, personally fit into this.  In one sentence you say, "they took my money, never sent me the order", then in the next sentence you said the "printer never worked correctly". 

So which one is it?

Did you get a printer but are unhappy with the way it works, or never got the printer and want a refund??

pirvan, Thanks for your reply, Sorry my english is not my native touge.

There is no doubt that what is happening to solidoodle is a business tragedy.
However, The point I am trying to make. is that we all know they are in a crises. its obvious but it does not automatically provide them with a justification to steal from people.

In my case i was swindled by solidoodle early on more than once.
Since I wanted them to succeed I didnt mind paying the premiums their business model added into their costs.
In general I thought solidoodle was amazing. I own 3 myself, In the beginning like many people here, I purchased a printer and when it did arrive it was broken.
I understood the technology was new, its not like I dont know what I was getting into.

No the printer was broken. ( no working ) paid good money for what was portrayed as a working 3d printer.
Yes conflict in the expected outcome in my purchase based on what was advertised.

I naturally attempted many times to contact them to tell them about this defect which for a beginning company like is common no big deal just get a replacement. and fix the out of order situation right?

Since I paid for their warranty which stated repairs or fixes, this sound fair.
well the result is they simply ignore you and what few response you manage to get out of them they end up never delivering. My conclusion is well its a scam then.

Its been so long now waiting for a response, I am a tinker, Iall just hack it now. I concluded I was swindled.Fine.I can accept that. But not happily.

But when I looked around the web and found many other people who where swindled too, one cant help but feel anger.
And the best I can do now is to help others avoid what happen to me.

I order many things from their website such as parts/abs which never received .
If you read the threads you will find that many people have experienced the same.

Anyway I am done with solidooldle they are thieves and liers.

I opened this thread because I am wondering what everyone else thinks.
And by the way this is not about using open source, or calling the credit card company.
I will back a company using open source , I support that business model anytime.
And credit card company wise, now I have to go down that path clearly.

This is about what is right and what is wrong. From a business ethics stand point.
Thousands of people have been basically scammed.
As I said, if solidoodle is going bankrupt, many startups do.
If solidoodle can no longer operate normal business operations.

They should:
Stop accepting credit card transactions.ASAP
Be transparent enough to communicate to the customer base, through social media ,what is going on.
hell maybe crowd sourcing can even pull them out of their mess. but once trust is violated like this.I doubt it.

Currently they do not answer emails or phone calls if you place in order they will charge your credit card.
and they will never send the purchased items.

Bottom Line.
When people give you their hard earned money in exchange for a product or service.
And then you as a business fail to take care of the customer. your business deserves to fail.
it is the principle.

And it is looks like like solidoodle is going to fail or already has.
Goodbye shitty solidoodle printers. with shitty customer service and false claims.
feel sorry for them but to a very small small point now.

Clearly what they are doing is illegal and fraudulent.
I say legality, lol Sarcam never translates well as they say : ) .

But the statement stands. yes what business rule allows for all this ? where is the business sense.
based on penal codes in N.Y they are easily in violation of many sections.

Forget about me, Solidoodle has not officially responded to the thousands of people who expected a shipment they never fulfilled it.
so can we classify this a legal or illegal are they getting away with it, how does this work exactly. 

As for where "I personally stand in this"  I will not do business again with them. I share my story.
-I will warn others so they dont get ripped off.

And I opened this thread in the effort to stimulate discussion so others can find some context.

like everyone here I m passionately addicted to 3d printing and the amazing things going for it.
mass society wise the economic positive impact is huge, essentially bringing even more wealth to the general stock
of human life improvements with that of the internet for example.

when you have a 3d printer you suddenly inherently have more wealth as a result.
wealth is not necessarily always economic, a 3d printer multiplies your opportunity to solve
issues in your life and in the world. it has an enormous return ratio.

I think its ethically and morally wrong to steal from DIY communities.
People who buy low cost 3d printers open source or not, are tinkers DIYers,creative hackers.
Engineers, progress is made by this kind of culture.

So bringing the business ethics "legality" and "illegality" of it all back to the table.

sorry for my English.

What do you think about all this ?

this topic did not need started as its been a topic for over a year as you alreay know here http://www.soliforum.com/topic/12450/qu … e-company/

and they are not a 'startup' only their last big screwup was sorta one that they duped people to buy into 6 months b4 ready to ship and since have continued that way even with products NOT made in Chine but in their own shop. they been making 3D printers low cost for many years and sold thousands and had much better customer service once upon a time B4 the big bad Panda bear got them ;^P and the last year or so many 3D printer makers have also bit the dust and left customers/investers high and dry with nary a Sympathy card. they also learned long ago how to ignor customers on their facebook site and web sites.

lesson 1. in any Business that grows fast. it dies faster once it makes a few bad mistakes. and one that most small companies make is NOT incorporating so that disgruntled Wives etc dont snuff it out b4 it takes off. another is getting China as a partner, then anything owner/management does to scam potential and current customers with promises you never fulfill no matter whos fault it is then treat employees like Tampons when you have used them up.

these 'mistakes' sum up like 90% of the affore mentioned 3D printer makers. most just dont care to cleanup whats left over and stop the bleeding of more customers once TSHTF

Ok, I think a few people need to take a step back and actually understand what this forum community is & is not... it is clearly stated in the Forum News & Announcements in a stickied post: http://www.soliforum.com/topic/2041/sol … uidelines/ (Very first forum topic, very first post - if you take the time to actually read things...)

of specific note:

Blaming the community members here for what is happening with Solidoodle, the company, is just plain WRONG!

It should also be noted that many here HAVE suggested folks try to get their money back for unfulfilled purchases via charge-backs on CCs and through the banking the institutions that purchases were made through, and have also suggested NOT attempting to purchase anything else from Solidoodle.

For those that did actually receive their printers and do not wish to try returning them and ending up with nothing (including no refund), the kind members here have attempted to help those folks get those printers up and running satisfactorily.

I have not seen anyone in this community praise Solidoodle, or recommend purchasing one of these machines - in fact, usually the opposite is true. What I have seen is people that are willing to help if you already have one and want to get it operating as well as possible.

And for the record, if I see someone asking about Solidoodle, say on one of the Facebook groups I belong to, I do tell them of the current problems with the company, and recommend they look elsewhere. As much as I like our SD4s, I will not recommend any of the SD printers as a "new" purchase. Buying used, however, is different.

As for the forum name? It was created years ago - before all of the problems started... trying to change it would be a royal PITA to say the least.

WTF even, Azerate? By "what logic"?
There are dozens of 3d printer forums and general home manufacturing forums (3d printer, CNC, etc.) with short and simple names.

Nobody is blaming the community for what is happening *in the company*, nor do you need to tell me that Soliforum is not an official forum.
What I am blaming *some* of the members here for is suggesting for newcomers to fix their essentially broken product instead of getting a refund time and time again and indirectly contributing to the Solidoodle inc. becoming what they are today because they didn't get as much negative feedback as they could have. And I'm also blaming this forum for not making a clear sticky, announcement or similar any visitor could see about the current situation with Solidoodle.
I was very clear on what I meant, but here's a reprhasing.

That comes with the territory when it comes to this tech. Learn it or find another hobby/production facility that knows how to print. This statement is not meant to offend...everyone starts somewhere and this forum has had no shortage of veterans volunteering their time.

People tend to do their homework before buying a product, and in the case of a Solidoodle, folks would invariably come to this site; and it is VERY CLEAR even to the unitiated that Solidoodle products have some issues.  Many are issues of normal calibrations, steps/mm, and other settings that need to be understood and tweaked by the user.  Other issues have been more major and require refitting and rebuilding.

If after you have read the feedback from this forum and decided to purchase a Solidoodle product, then you were well aware of the issues.  What Ian and the other members have stated above is correct...at this point in time you are better off fixing it and having a printer that works (and will usually work very well) versus chasing a refund that you will probably never receive.

As far as "understanding everything about your printer" being the nature of the tech at the moment, please enlighten the rest of us as to which printers prove this to be untrue...I have a friend with a $30,000 Stratasys that has been down for repairs for the last 3 weeks.  Someday the tech will get there...

Vivi,
you are obviously unaware of the hundreds of 3D printer manufactures as well as forums that have come and gone world wide the past 3-4 years. even the big brand names like Makerbot have fel aprt many times and let their own forums go. hence many more brands posting on this forum now and Brad and his team have even made pages to acomidate them as well as other languages. there are even more current 3D printer makers dropping like flys as we speak. and lots of other sources for reviews etc of said companies both good and bad. these manufacturers dont care to engage in debates here or anyplace as that leads to even more litigation which is not why they are in business. they delete any objectionable posts on their own sites they operate/d to save face. hopefully the name of this forum draws more victims of Solidoodles ill fate so we can help them salvage as much as possible of their dreams of having their own 3D printer running.

I have watched many youtube videos to support what I have said, one just last night about the failing ibox Nano SLA which was 16mins long a very un-biased review stating how he loved their proof of consept and hoped they could improve its areas falling short on delivery like very poor repeatability in finished prints (like %10 good quality results of same model, and tiny build surface besides the usual issue with SLA printers run at ultra fine detail layers lloonnggggg build times like a tiny model that would take 15mins on an SD2 runs 4.5 hours on the ibox Nano then it may be useless when finished wasting time and material which is more costly than ABS filament btw.

this forum has had many topics on Solidoodles problems the last year and we dont need any more as this is not Solidoodles complaints dept. maybe try their partners in China if NY is not answering ;^)

Mitch

I'll be very clear and concise since I don't have any more time to waste with your posts...Find another hobby!

Yes. Of course.

No, just sticky the thread where Solinonymous posted, as well as several other disappointed customers. You found it worth to sticky the "Solidoodle Review Compilation" thread which hasn't been posted to since 2013 but not that?

No. But if I were you I would make the sticky accessible as an "announcement" clickable anywhere in the forum.

this guy sounds very much like another dude that used to be on here a couple years ago under multiple names. if 3D printing is not his job, nor hobby but extra money... WTH is it to him other than just rambling to annoy others enjoyment of it.