826 Reply by IanJohnson

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

The washer in the socket didn't work out for me -

http://solidoodletips.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/photo-37.jpg

I finally figured out how to drill a #52 bit all of the way through a 30mm brass bolt without breaking it.  Since I have 6mm brass bolts that fit a PEEK hot end insulator, I drilled one through with the #52 bit and used it to attach one of the spare insulators I have laying around to the plug.  I was hoping that filament would swell to the usual 1.7 or so and push through the insulator as it is cooled and held steady.  There is enough friction inside the insulator that the filament came out at 2mm, but it only varied .03-.05mm.  I put most of the insulator inside the fan duct, and the temp at the plug dropped to 175 and stayed no matter where I set the PID.  I pulled the duct back so only the end of the insulator was inside and the temp rose to 185.

The filament was only extruding about 2-3"/min, but it went almost 18" before it even touched the workbench.  It can definitely be handled without problem.   I'm going to make another try at a 1.7mm cold end, since this approach shows promise.

http://solidoodletips.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/photo1.jpg

Before I put on the PEEK, I tried extruding through the bolt by itself.   If the bolt was cooled, the extruder couldn't get the plastic out.  It might be worth experimenting with that some more, but I think it will take another thermocouple at the end of the bolt and speed control on the fan to find the right temperature.

I got the spring washers, but foolishly ordered 5/8" ID, because you know, the auger is 5/8".  The shaft however is 3/8".  I put them in anyway, in 3 pairs oriented to have 350lb max load.  I didn't see an improvement in accuracy, but if I heard the motor start to struggle, I could look over and see them start to compress.  I'm not sure exactly what benefit they would have, but I have a feeling they would be a good addition.  I'll look into it more once I have the right size.

827 Reply by mmorning

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

I am sorry if I missed it and admittedly I haven't read through all 34 pages of post.

But is there a current BOM and drawings/specs listed somewhere. I noticed right away that the motor that was listed on one of the pages wasn't available anymore.

828 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

Not publicly, no. I got your email though, and will respond soon.

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829 Reply by mmorning

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

elmoret Thank you very much.. actually just caught up on the reading and did notice that you the BOM isnt published. But i will say I love even more of the ideas that I am reading.

Such things as puller and laser measuring.. Great work!

830 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

IanJohnson wrote:

The washer in the socket didn't work out for me -

Same happened to me. Ended up using a piece of sheet metal I cut, that held for 25 hours or so, then I upgraded to the new motor for good.

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831 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

IanJohnson wrote:

Before I put on the PEEK, I tried extruding through the bolt by itself.   If the bolt was cooled, the extruder couldn't get the plastic out.  It might be worth experimenting with that some more, but I think it will take another thermocouple at the end of the bolt and speed control on the fan to find the right temperature.

I got the spring washers, but foolishly ordered 5/8" ID, because you know, the auger is 5/8".  The shaft however is 3/8".  I put them in anyway, in 3 pairs oriented to have 350lb max load.  I didn't see an improvement in accuracy, but if I heard the motor start to struggle, I could look over and see them start to compress.  I'm not sure exactly what benefit they would have, but I have a feeling they would be a good addition.  I'll look into it more once I have the right size.

That's good news! I've been waiting on my PEEK from Chicago McMaster - it was out of stock and finally shipped yesterday. I'm hoping to do something similar.

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832 Reply by OSPrinting

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

So I wanted to show you guys the choice of colors I have from one company. Now this colorant is good for all types of plastic. You just change the ratio you mix them at. I am thinking Sky Blue, Fire Engine Red, and Citrus. What do you guys think? Sorry the colors did not come out as vibrant as they are on the sheet..

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833 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

OSPrinting wrote:

Now this colorant is good for all types of plastic. You just change the ratio you mix them at.

How is this possible? It melts at 50C but doesn't char at 300C?

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834 Reply by IanJohnson

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

You should try to get them to send you a sample of their metallics.  I would love to see how one of those works for filament.  Hopefully they will get back to you, I couldn't get a quote from them.

835 Reply by DePartedPrinter

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

OSPrinting wrote:

So I wanted to show you guys the choice of colors I have from one company. Now this colorant is good for all types of plastic. You just change the ratio you mix them at. I am thinking Sky Blue, Fire Engine Red, and Citrus. What do you guys think? Sorry the colors did not come out as vibrant as they are on the sheet..

I think that red is to dark. I vote admiral red. 

Looking forward to testing these. Keep us updated.

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836 Reply by IanJohnson

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

These were my picks - Ultra Blue UN5179
Strawberry Red UN3223
Canary Yellow UN1700
White UN001
Ebony UN0086

Also Transparent Grey UN7903TR and Aztec Gold UN0548

837 Reply by R.J.A.Allen

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

Hi Guys,

Should have posted earlier but didn't have a lot to say till now. Customs have finally allowed my Filastuder into the UK, Thanks Tim, (BTW I had to pay £20 import tax, not a problem, but thought you'd like to know in case you send more kits in this direction!). Anyway I haven't really had time to get stuck in yet as my printer is giving me grief at the moment, but will be fixed today.

So hopefully tomorrow I will build the filastruder!!!

Anyway two questions really,

1. Anyone tried to extrude 3mm diameter filament yet, I will be trying this straight away as thats the filament I use, Figured I'd just drill the die proportionally largely and probablly slightly on the cautious side to start with.

2. Has anyone else got one of these kits outside the US yet? I'm slightly concerned that the heater is a 100w 120V unit, is this connected directly to the mains supply and relay switched? If so my mains supply is 240V thus I'm not sure this is a good scenario? Draws less current, but the voltage may destroy the heater, do you guys think it would be better to get a different heater or drop the voltage somehow? Any thoughts? I may well answer these questions myself tomorrow but like I said I haven't had the time to get properly stuck in yet!

Cheers chaps,


Rob

838 Reply by Dennis

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

R.J.A.Allen wrote:

Hi Guys,

I'm slightly concerned that the heater is a 100w 120V unit, is this connected directly to the mains supply and relay switched? If so my mains supply is 240V thus I'm not sure this is a good scenario? Draws less current, but the voltage may destroy the heater, do you guys think it would be better to get a different heater or drop the voltage somehow?
Rob

It is best to use a heater rated for the voltage.  At 240V it becomes a 200W heater and might not survive.  You can cut the duty cycle in half with a power diode in series, which will cut it back to 100W average.

839 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

Dennis wrote:

It is best to use a heater rated for the voltage.  At 240V it becomes a 200W heater and might not survive.

Becomes 400w, not 200w.

I have a couple thoughts on this, I'll post later today.

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840 Reply by R.J.A.Allen

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

Ok guys Thanks, I might have a little look see if I can't get hold of a 100W 240V heater from somewhere here,

Cheers,

Rob

841 Reply by Dennis

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

elmoret wrote:
Dennis wrote:

It is best to use a heater rated for the voltage.  At 240V it becomes a 200W heater and might not survive.

Becomes 400w, not 200w.

I have a couple thoughts on this, I'll post later today.

I stand corrected:  Power = Current SQUARED times Resistance
So a diode would make it 200W -- instead of the desired 100W

842 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

R.J.A.Allen wrote:

Ok guys Thanks, I might have a little look see if I can't get hold of a 100W 240V heater from somewhere here,

Cheers,

Rob

You definitely can, I'll try to help with this later today. There's a small chance I sent you one rated for 240v. Can you measure the heater's resistance?

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843 Reply by bbulzak

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

Hi everyone,

I finally had some time to go through most of the thread. It is a very interesting project and seems like you guys are making great progress. At this time, do you intend on experimenting with a breaker plate? This could probably help with stabilizing the extrusion speed and take care of the contamination but the drawback is that it would probably require regular cleaning which could be a pain and possibly more than what an average 3d printer user is willing to deal with. Not to mention that you would probably need to machine the breakaway plate and the screen.

Is contamination still a problem? From what I could gather, everyone but Elmoret is still seing foreign particles in the extrudate?

Thanks

BB

844 Reply by IanJohnson

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

At 3mm it will feed reallly slow.  The larger die is like taking your thumb away from a garden hose so it doesn't squirt anymore.  For the best results at 3mm I think you would want a faster motor or a larger barrel/auger to create more pressure.

845 Reply by R.J.A.Allen

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

You may well be correct, but I would think it might be more complicated than that. I guess a combination of factors are involved, the resistance to flow caused by the smaller dye maybe considerablly greater than you imagine as the molten polymer is highly viscous, thus more force is required to drive it through a smaller dye.

Not the same I know but an interesting analogy,

In fine capillaries the height that water will rise to is greater at smaller diameters, however the speed at which is rises is slower, due to viscous losses,

but will we see, and if need be I will get a beefier motor or find another way around!

Cheers,

Rob

846 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

Okay, here's my thoughts. First, 3mm:

You will probably need a larger motor to get best results. You can run that motor on 18v, as long not getting too hot to keep your hand on comfortably. At 18v, you should be spinning almost 2x faster than on 12v. That should be enough to make up for the area being nearly 3x larger.

Heater:
I might have shipped you one rated at 240v/150w. If that's the case (I think it was only the case for the first 4 beta testers), then at 120v, you get 37.5w, and at 240v, you get 150w. It would be fine running that on 240v. The PID and power supply can both handle 240v.

If it is rated at 120v/100w, which I think is the case, then running at 240v would make 400w of heat. In theory this should be fine - the heaters are rated to 480C, but I wouldn't recommend it. A temporary workaround would be to wire two 100w 240v household bulbs in parallel with each other, and then put that in series with the heater. That would give you 44w on the heater, which should do fine. I can also send you a 240v version, or help you pick one out.

I do apologize for not thinking about power standards before shipping yours!

Future versions will use a auto-ranging power supply, and run everything off the power supply output, to make it more international-friendly.

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847 Reply by Zarni

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

Rob,
As a quick voltage reducer use a dimmer switch, most of them are rated for 500w per circuit. You can then just monitor the voltage out of it and adjust it to whatever power you like. Just make sure you start at the lowest setting :-)
I know you're not going to get a lovely sine wave out of it but as it is only a heater so that shouldn't be a problem.

848 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

That should be ok, as long as the insulation is rated for it - most dimmers chop the input to produce the output, but it should work fine.

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849 Reply by R.J.A.Allen

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

No worries, its definately 110V 100W,

I can get a nice step down unit that does 200W 110V (it's specifically designed for adapting US products to UK products) for £40 from a local supplier and it has the benefit of having a nice kettle plug, so I will just mount a nice little plug somewhere!

Don't worry about the extra cost for me as I won't be paying for it personally if you get my drift..

Probablly worth thinking about for future kits,

regarding the motor, where I work there should be plenty lying around that I could 'borrow' for an experiment if I need more power.

Cheers,

Rob

850 Reply by Dennis

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Re: Filament Extruder - Convert pellets to filament

Tim,
I was reviewing this patent:
http://www.google.com/patents/US6866807 … mp;f=false
I was only issued in 2005.  I was wondering if it is still in force?
It seems to cover the various methods of making 1.75mm filament for 3D printers, and using 1.75mm filament for FDM.
I am wondering if the current suppliers of filament are making it under a license?