Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Why is this stickied here, and not in the Software & Firmware section? It is a little confusing.
Lead Programmer & Co-Owner of Camshaft Software - Creators of Automation - The Car Company Tycoon Game
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
are there differences that we should be aware of between merlin for sd2 and sd3?
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
The only difference I can think of would be the lines that tell the printer what the coordinates are after it homes.
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
So I've been having a problem updating firmware and it won't let me upload through USB. I tried for hours and going through Ian's instructions and all the forums I could find and finally gave up. I sent an email to support and they sent me a PDF explaining to me how to build/buy a bootloader or a something called an AVR programer. I really don't think I should be asked to purchase anything extra to update the firmware especially since you guys have updated it without anything extra. Also there was no mention of needing anything other than the printer and another computer in the description when I purchased the printer. Is there anything that you guys can think of that I'm doing wrong?
Thanks in advance for the help.
Here is the PDF they sent to me just in case anyone wants to take a look.
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
That is rubbish.
Solidoodle have made the mistake of ordering a batch of micro controllers without boot loaders, which that PDF seems to prove. All you should need is a micro controller with the bootloader already on it, and then you will be able to update like usually.
Whether you get a programmer to alter your MC or get another one, you should NOT have to pay for it. This is a Solidoodle mistake and them palming you off like that is really dodgy.
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Thanks a million Lawsy.
Ill have to give support a piece of your mind! 
32 2013-01-06 12:38:49 (edited by MeshMoth 2013-01-06 13:45:16)
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
OK, so here is a pretty nice email that support got back to me with... thanks! 
Hi guys, I've read the PDF and asked on soliforum to also lend a hand in helping me update the firmware. No one really came up with anything other than to have the motherboard replaced.
This is certainly not what you need.
I knew there was an issue with a bad batch of motherboards,
No, there was not. There has never been a recall on the boards, nor a consistent set of issues with them. There was a run of chips with boot loaders missing, yes. But this is not a problem that would be best resolved by sending a whole new board. The chips itself is fully functional - it just needs a tiny bit of programming to do what you want it to do.
and I was asking you guys if there was anyway to fix it without replacing the boards. Buying a bootloader for the board
This statement does not make any sense, one does not buy a boot loader.
is a fix but I don't feel I should be buying extra parts due to the fact that every one else can update the firmware
We have said on a number of occasions that we do not feel upgrading to community firmware is a feature, nor do we guarantee this functionality in any way shape or form. If you feel that programming the bootloader on to the board is beyond your capabilities, then I am sure there is a third party who would sell you a chip with a pre-flashed bootloader. This is sort of a waste of money since the programmer cable is cheap, and easy to use.
without purchasing any extra hardware on their own. Im not the most electronically inclined when it comes to schematics a soldering so it would be a struggle for me to even build one.
Build a what? If the only programmer capable you can find needs some assembly, and you feel you are not qualified, I can help you find someone to sell you a pre-soldered one. That said, I highly recommend the kit - it is easy to put together and use.
It's obvious that it is a mistake and the bad motherboard got shipped.
No, your ATMega644p chip is simply missing a bootloader. Bootloaders are not at all necessary for the proper functioning of the machine, software, and firmware. They simply enable you to change the firmware, which we do not always recommend. We have provided you a way to do this with the documentation that was sent to you before. It works fine without it, and since you have our latest official firmware there is zero reason you should need to mess with it.
So, I'd really appreciate it if you guys could get that resolved with out having me purchase more parts.
Also just an FYI, I am going to be out of state for 2 months, so I cannot do any trouble shooting at the moment. So, I will save any solutions that you guys come up with and do them as soon as get back. If you guys must replace the board or ship me a bootloader,
Once again, bootloaders are a small piece of code. They are not shippable, and to my knowledge your Solidoodle is fully functional in every sense that our company evaluates. For a small amount of money, you can get the functionality you would like via a programmer cable or a pre-flashed chip.
Perhaps you should read this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boot_loade … t_loaders. You are continually referring to us shipping you a bootloader when a bootloader is a piece of low level firmware that is flashed on to the board. This is what we are trying to teach you to do. There is zero chance of us sending you a replacement motherboard for this. The problem is comparable to you asking for a replacement laptop because internet explorer is missing. Again, we are talking about $20 worth of extra electronics which will teach you a new skill or two, and liberate you from ever having to worry about this with any arduino based device. I strongly recommend you take this option.
I can email you guy again in two months, so I will be home to receive it and ship back the old one.
Again, we shall not be replacing your motherboard, as this is unnecessary. Given that you have stated that you are not technically inclined, I recommended that you do not remove your mother board. It could be ruined by improper handling.
I am definitely not in a rush for it but I just wanted to let you guys know my problem as soon as I could before it gets too far down the road.
Thank you guys for all the hard work, great printer and so far great support. I wish everyone there a happy and prosperous new year!
We are more than happy to work with you to help you with this problem, but at this point the ball is in your court. If you need step by step help flashing the bootloader on to your chip, we would be more than happy to provide it. However, please do note that your mother board is not damaged, nor do we view it is replaceable given the current circumstances. Let us know how you'd like to move forward, and we will support you the best we can.
Regards,
John
OK, I may have been wrong a lot in the email. And it's totally obvious that I don't know much about electronics or programming, but it sounds like I kinda pissed him off by asking for something that I thought was a malfunction in the printer because I thought everyone else can do it. I definitely didn't read anywhere on their website that only a select lucky majority can upgrade. I also definitely did not read anywhere on the firmware update page that I will need extra hardware to update my firmware when I bought it. Maybe he was a little cranky because I woke him up and he emailed me back at almost 3AM on the east coast and he needs to get up in 3 or 4 hrs... but that's why it was an email and I didn't call his cell phone...
I knew there was an issue with a bad batch of motherboards,
No, there was not. There has never been a recall on the boards, nor a consistent set of issues with them. There was a run of chips with boot loaders missing, yes. But this is not a problem that would be best resolved by sending a whole new board. The chips itself is fully functional - it just needs a tiny bit of programming to do what you want it to do.
here is what I took from that.
...So a run of chips with missing bootloaders is not a bad batch of motherboards... hmmm...
...And it's not worth it to satisfy a customer that obviously has some thing MISSING from your product.
...And don't be an imbecile and do it yourself!... (Even though your customer clearly stated they don't know how to.)
...Go pay someone else to do something that we forgot to do.
...Our printer works perfectly. "just dont hold it like that" (-Late Steve Jobs.)
And I totally thought someone on this forum was able to get theirs replaced because of this problem... but, I'm probably definitely wrong.
It's obvious that it is a mistake and the bad motherboard got shipped.
No, your ATMega644p chip is simply missing a bootloader. Bootloaders are not at all necessary for the proper functioning of the machine, software, and firmware. They simply enable you to change the firmware, which we do not always recommend. We have provided you a way to do this with the documentation that was sent to you before. It works fine without it, and since you have our latest official firmware there is zero reason you should need to mess with it.
...so this was not a mistake? You meant to have missing boot loaders?
If there was zero reason to upgrade, then why was I trying to upgrade? Why does my printer print objects all screwed up and wobbly? Why is it when I make a square, one axis prints out longer than the other even though I followed the video on how to make a circle? Why are there forum topics on how to change the firmware? Why are so many people switching to an unofficial release of firmware made by someone that is actually trying to help out? Why is said firmware package linked on your website? Why did i just copy and paste this quote from your website? "(for reference here is the previous obsolete version that we used to use: The Solidoodle July 31st Marlin Build)" Why are you using community firmware if it's not recommended?
without purchasing any extra hardware on their own. Im not the most electronically inclined when it comes to schematics a soldering so it would be a struggle for me to even build one.
Build a what? If the only programmer capable you can find needs some assembly, and you feel you are not qualified, I can help you find someone to sell you a pre-soldered one. That said, I highly recommend the kit - it is easy to put together and use.
Oh, so you knew what...
We have said on a number of occasions that we do not feel upgrading to community firmware is a feature, nor do we guarantee this functionality in any way shape or form. If you feel that programming the bootloader on to the board is beyond your capabilities, then I am sure there is a third party who would sell you a chip with a pre-flashed bootloader. This is sort of a waste of money since the programmer cable is cheap, and easy to use.
Good business tips by Solidoodle #2353: Cover your ass and tell customers their particular problem is not your problem.
Good business tips by Solidoodle #2354: Tell your customer to buy and learn more stuff when you forgot to do it. Oh, While you are at it, tell them its a great learning experience, because your product is totally user friendly that you never need to calibrate/adjust/upgrade/or tinker with anything at all because its perfect when you shipped it... oh except you just need to add a tad of grease once in a blue...
Good business tips by Solidoodle #2355: After telling your customer to go replace things themselves, convince them it's totally not worth the price because it's just so cheap and easy to learn how to do your job.
Anyway, there is no need for me to reply to this email as they are pretty firm on not shipping me a bootloader... 
And Im kinda replying now, but just want to share for those who care.
So for the others that are technically declined, Solidoodle won't replace your motherboard if you can't/don't know how to, or don't feel you should purchase $20 worth simple electronics to update the firmware ...because it's not a feature
...that everyone else can do
...except me
...even though there's a full page on how use that non-feature
...for mac, windows and linux.
Cheers! Hope everyone is having a happy new year!
New Years Resolution: gon' try an' go lern me sumtin nu!
...when I get back home.
"Congratulations! Your firmware is not up to date."
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Hey Meshmoth. While I agree with you that this is an unfair, and questionable stance on the part of Solidoodle, and a prime example of someone getting their panties in a wad in their tech support group, there is an easy fix. A 1284 will happily replace the 644 and are easily found in many places with the boot loader burned in already. For example, check with the folks that sell the kits for the Panelolu, or here on ebay. http://www.ebay.com/itm/ATMEL-ATMEGA128 … 3f135b497a where they sell one for less than $13.
Good luck on getting this cleared up. If worse comes to worse, I have a programmer, as I am certain many on this board do, but I doubt I could beat the prices of someone already set up to buy in mass and deliver.
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
There isn't really a need to update the firmware. The only difference in Lawsy's current version is some changes for the Panelolu and backlash compensation, which isn't working properly yet. You can adjust steps/mm via gcode commands.
If you want to add a fan, you will need to update the firmware to enable the fan pin. If you want to run a LCD panel, you would need to upgrade the chip anyway.
Solidoodle is painting themselves into a corner with this stance however. If they ever want to update the firmware again, they will have a lot of users who are stuck. They can hardly say - "Here is an updated firmware which enables some great new features! Some of you won't be able to update due to a mistake we made a while back, so too bad for you."
Still, replacing the 644p chip with the missing bootloader with a 1284p is fairly cheap and easy and gives you a better chip which is capable of running a panel. All you have to do it pop the old one out (a little fiddly), snap the new one in, and load the firmware.
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
As they say, a bootloader is just a piece of code of the chip that allows you to update it. I have written an article that you may find helpful in understanding what a bootloader is and where it fits into the general scheme of things.
http://www.soliwiki.com/3D_Printing_Har … ftware_101
They might be technically correct about never advertising updating functionality, but they also supply in their own documentation instructions for updating the firmware. This means they have supplied you with a product that is not capable of fulfilling all functionality they document, even if it is not explicitly mentioned in the shopping cart section.
Frankly their attitude stinks, and they should be sending you a new chip with a bootloader in place.
If you are indeed stuck without their help, buy your own chip with bootloader, but get the higher rated 1284P as others have mentioned. It is a direct replacement and has enough room for the extra code needed to control add-ons. Most importantly, it will allow you to update the firmware whenever you want, whether for calibration or updates.
My work is interested in buying another couple of 3D printers, and for a time I considered two Solidoodle 3s, but things like remind me how horrible their customer service is and questionable their ethics are, so I will take the money elsewhere.
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Hey guys thanks for the help and support, it's greatly appreciated. Spending money to upgrade the chip is much more worth learning about than to fix someone else's mistake.
Anyway, the email speaks for itself, and needless to say (but I'm going to say it anyway), they've lost any future business from me and definitely will be discouraging anyone that I know from purchasing any of their products.
I think I've given this company the most faith and patience in any product I've ever bought. I would have thought they would value customers more especially after going through the entire waiting process and delay, after delay, after delay, they would show the same gratitude to their customers. But, I guess they've had a pretty good history of having bad business practices that I really shouldn't have expected anything more.
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
lawsy wrote:
As they say, a bootloader is just a piece of code of the chip that allows you to update it. I have written an article that you may find helpful in understanding what a bootloader is and where it fits into the general scheme of things.
http://www.soliwiki.com/3D_Printing_Har … ftware_101
They might be technically correct about never advertising updating functionality, but they also supply in their own documentation instructions for updating the firmware. This means they have supplied you with a product that is not capable of fulfilling all functionality they document, even if it is not explicitly mentioned in the shopping cart section.
Frankly their attitude stinks, and they should be sending you a new chip with a bootloader in place.
If you are indeed stuck without their help, buy your own chip with bootloader, but get the higher rated 1284P as others have mentioned. It is a direct replacement and has enough room for the extra code needed to control add-ons. Most importantly, it will allow you to update the firmware whenever you want, whether for calibration or updates.
My work is interested in buying another couple of 3D printers, and for a time I considered two Solidoodle 3s, but things like remind me how horrible their customer service is and questionable their ethics are, so I will take the money elsewhere.
We give out a large number of parts every week, free of charge and give free tune ups to those having troubles which tech support cannot rectify over the phone. Our intention is not to withhold tech support to anyone. However, our main objective is to ensure the Solidoodle is functional, and to help customers with most severe issues quickly. Remember we are a small company with limited resources. It is vital for us to thoroughly sort, sift, and double check every repair part that is sent out, ensuring that this is something that is actually needed. This sometimes means debates with tech support stretch longer than what would be optimal. Indeed
This issue with the bootloaders, while pertaining to a limited time in the past, and a very specific run of Solidoodles, has easily been the most emotionally charged issue in Solidoodle tech support. While many users have been extremely patient about replacing whole assemblies of the printer, sometimes improving the design themselves in process, the boot loader issue has caused a great deal of anger and confusion.
After some lengthy debate we agreed to swap out this customer's chip. In the beginning of the (very limited) period of boot loader issues we were giving out these chips left and right. This policy turned into a major problem, as we were discovering that many users were still having issues even after installing a chip confirmed to have a bootloader. At the same time we were getting a large influx of a very emotional pleas for free replacement parts. Although we were using the very latest firmware at the time, many users had been misinformed that their printers would be totally non-functional sans firmware upgrade. We had users demanding boot loaders before they had even attempted a print.
Essentially at one point we simply could not ship out these chips, as a significant number were not helping the issue. There was simply a hold on these chips. We suggested to several customers that they send us back their chips so that we could investigate them ourselves. As the specific nature of the problem still was unclear. In some cases we got back boot loader chips that updated firmware just fine. When we would suggest that the customer send back their chip the response was typically very negative, demanding we send them a free replacement immediately, no questions asked. The most effective solution, angering the least number of customers was to simply offer instructions to install the boot loader itself. I repeat, this made most people far less angry than offering to swap their chip via mail, and sending out a replacement directly wasn't an option at the time. While you may observe, and I agree, that it may have been more wise to make it clear to customers. I also agree that my stance here may seem a bit agressive. I apologize for that.
I'm sure those of you who watch this kind of thing have noticed that our track record for support has improved over time. We are slowly crawling out of the backlog, and as we get closer to working in real time I think you'll see a dramatic improvement in our ability to react to these problems quickly. You may have also noticed that the severe, shipping related damage has slowed to a crawl. We want you to know that tech support is getting smoother around here. However, we cannot always send out parts the very moment we receive a request. Believe me, if it were as simple as shipping a person a free replacement the very moment they asked for one, we would gladly send one out. However, we must perform our due diligence and make sure that what we send out doesn't cause more problems. We aren't trying to perform any kind of "shady" business practices, we are just a little slow, and we must act carefully. We have nothing to gain from frustrating customers.
I hope you all understand that we are always open for friendly debate, and we would never turn away a customer with a broken Solidoodle.
Regards,
John
Former Solidoodle employee, no longer associated with the company.
38 2013-01-28 09:24:11 (edited by MeshMoth 2013-01-28 09:26:21)
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Was never looking for a damn debate... I just wanted to be able to update firmware without having to purchase new components in order to make a machine to work properly. You argue that the printer is working properly since it does print. But, everyone including myself agrees that it isn't properly functioning if every other machine can be updated and a small batch/run of chips cannot be updated.
You guys screwed up buy purchasing these chips that should have never made it out of the factory and now you want your customers to fix the mistake you made and giving me your crappy attitude at the same time...
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Mesh,
Nowhere did they list firmware updates as a feature. Your printer prints.
http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewitem … 1657755948
$15 shipped. Can we get back on topic now?
40 2013-02-08 22:07:27 (edited by brett 2013-02-09 02:15:42)
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Anyone know if this is the same firmware used for the SD3? Says so when I connect with RH. Need to fix the rate of extrusion.
EDIT: never mind it looks like it's already compensated for in slic3r
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Thanks for the ebay link. Bought one 
42 2013-02-24 09:08:42 (edited by lawsy 2013-02-24 09:09:24)
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Ok. I've just done a major update.
Solidoodle2-marlin is now based on the newest Marlin which has many new features, like this one:
M600 - Pause for filament change X[pos] Y[pos] Z[relative lift] E[initial retract] L[later retract distance for removal]Neil Martin's hysteresis support has been dropped and ideally the z banding fix will be added soon by Rincewind/tealvince.
I have also added thermistor support for QU-BD silicone beds with built in thermistor. I suppose a QU-BD hotend will also work if it uses the same thermistor.
A lot has been changed so please consider this experimental until I can test it for a couple of days and catch any bugs.
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
I added the Z banding fix, you should be able to use it following the instructions here: http://www.soliwiki.com/Calibration_of_the_Z_wobble
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
What about solidoodle 3? There are reports that the firmware also works with SD3, provided that the max values for the three axes are set correctly, can anybody with an SD3 confirm this? Lawsy, if this is confirmed, should we add a
#define SOLIDOODLE 2 // (or 3)that sets the right values?
Solidoodle support, are you willing to send Lawsy (and maybe also me) a SD3 for free so we can test this?
45 2013-02-27 14:59:55 (edited by rjp350z 2013-02-27 15:01:04)
- rjp350z
- Member
- Offline
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Rincewind wrote:
What about solidoodle 3? There are reports that the firmware also works with SD3, provided that the max values for the three axes are set correctly, can anybody with an SD3 confirm this? Lawsy, if this is confirmed, should we add a
#define SOLIDOODLE 2 // (or 3)that sets the right values?
Solidoodle support, are you willing to send Lawsy (and maybe also me) a SD3 for free so we can test this?
Rincewind, I upgraded my SD3 before I realized that the code was only for SD2. I've been printing for a couple of days now (basically just test prints trying to dial in all calibrations) and I only chaged the x and y endstop ranges (159 to 209 + 150 to 200) inside the Configuration.h
http://www.soliforum.com/topic/1390/sol … -firmware/
Forgot all about the Z and will look at again tonight when I get home and give you an update.
As I have not tried to print anything that comes even close fto MAX settings all seems to be working correctly at this point.
- rjp350z
- Member
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Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Rincewind/Lawsy,
Below are the only changes I made so far for my SD3. Need to figure out the MAX Z
Seems to be working fine at the moment
#define min_software_endstops false //If true, axis won't move to coordinates less than HOME_POS.
#define max_software_endstops false //If true, axis won't move to coordinates greater than the defined lengths below.
// Travel limits after homing
#define X_MAX_POS 209 //was 159
#define X_MIN_POS 0
#define Y_MAX_POS 200 //was 150
#define Y_MIN_POS 0
#define Z_MAX_POS 150 // not changed yet need to figure out what value to use
#define Z_MIN_POS 0
#define X_MAX_LENGTH (X_MAX_POS - X_MIN_POS)
#define Y_MAX_LENGTH (Y_MAX_POS - Y_MIN_POS)
#define Z_MAX_LENGTH (Z_MAX_POS - Z_MIN_POS)
// The position of the homing switches
//#define MANUAL_HOME_POSITIONS // If defined, MANUAL_*_HOME_POS below will be used
//#define BED_CENTER_AT_0_0 // If defined, the center of the bed is at (X=0, Y=0)
//Manual homing switch locations:
#define MANUAL_X_HOME_POS 209 //was 159
#define MANUAL_Y_HOME_POS 200 //was 150
#define MANUAL_Z_HOME_POS 0
- rjp350z
- Member
- Offline
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
rjp350z wrote:
Rincewind/Lawsy,
Below are the only changes I made so far for my SD3. Need to figure out the MAX Z
Seems to be working fine at the moment
#define min_software_endstops false //If true, axis won't move to coordinates less than HOME_POS.
#define max_software_endstops false //If true, axis won't move to coordinates greater than the defined lengths below.
// Travel limits after homing
#define X_MAX_POS 209 //was 159
#define X_MIN_POS 0
#define Y_MAX_POS 200 //was 150
#define Y_MIN_POS 0
#define Z_MAX_POS 150 // not changed yet need to figure out what value to use
#define Z_MIN_POS 0#define X_MAX_LENGTH (X_MAX_POS - X_MIN_POS)
#define Y_MAX_LENGTH (Y_MAX_POS - Y_MIN_POS)
#define Z_MAX_LENGTH (Z_MAX_POS - Z_MIN_POS)// The position of the homing switches
//#define MANUAL_HOME_POSITIONS // If defined, MANUAL_*_HOME_POS below will be used
//#define BED_CENTER_AT_0_0 // If defined, the center of the bed is at (X=0, Y=0)//Manual homing switch locations:
#define MANUAL_X_HOME_POS 209 //was 159
#define MANUAL_Y_HOME_POS 200 //was 150
#define MANUAL_Z_HOME_POS 0
Ok, Sitting at work thinking about the config above, Being SOLIDOODLE states the printing area is 8" x 8" x 8" I assume the MAX Z position should be set to about 200 but am afraid to try it as I do not want to have Extruder slamming into the bed.
I think I just need to measure from the Bed (in fully down position) up to the Z Stop to get the accurate setting. Am I correct in my assumption?
Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
rjp350z wrote:
Ok, Sitting at work thinking about the config above, Being SOLIDOODLE states the printing area is 8" x 8" x 8" I assume the MAX Z position should be set to about 200 but am afraid to try it as I do not want to have Extruder slamming into the bed.
I think I just need to measure from the Bed (in fully down position) up to the Z Stop to get the accurate setting. Am I correct in my assumption?
I also think 200 is the right value, and the extruder won't slam into the bed, as the extruder touching the bed is Z=0, which is where the endstop is. Do this: set Z_MAX_POS to 200, then open repetier or pronterface, home the axes and start lowering the bed. Go slowly when it reaches 190 or so, and check that it can actually reach 200 without touching the Z motor (that would be unpleasant). If you see that it's about to touch the motor sooner, check the maximum Z that it reaches and put that in the firmware.
It will be perfectly safe.
- rjp350z
- Member
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Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Thanks Rince, Will try that as soon as Iget home
- rjp350z
- Member
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Re: Solidoodle2-marlin firmware update thread
Rince,
Good thing I took your advise. I homed the bed and get down to 195 before the bed bottoms out. So I guess 200 is not the right value. I will go with like 194 for now just to play it safe. For now I have nothing on the Horizon that even comes close to that height.