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Topic: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

I just received my much anticipated Solidoodle today, and in running a few sample prints, there seems to be an issue with the layers lining up properly on top of the previous layer.  See the attached photo.

What causes this?

Can someone help?

Thanks,
EarhornJones

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-Solidoodle 2 Pro with glass bed and custom enclosure.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Skipping on the y-axis. Do a search.

Possible causes:
Belts not tightened evenly
Y-axis motor being under driven by stepper driver
Binding along the slide rails

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

elmoret wrote:

Skipping on the y-axis. Do a search.

Possible causes:
Belts not tightened evenly
Y-axis motor being under driven by stepper driver
Binding along the slide rails

Shouldn't most of those been found out during the testing phase before shipping?

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

My guesses.

Electronics could be overheating
Or the print is not sticking.
Or trying to print at too high a speed.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

lotw_1 wrote:
elmoret wrote:

Skipping on the y-axis. Do a search.

Possible causes:
Belts not tightened evenly
Y-axis motor being under driven by stepper driver
Binding along the slide rails

Shouldn't most of those been found out during the testing phase before shipping?

I am sure it worked when they tested it before it got shipped, however during shipping who knows what the poor thing went through... sever impacts, temperature extremes, vibration testing...

impacts during shipping could easily knock the carriage out of alignment or loosened setscrews, wiring or many other things

first thing to try is unplug the printer and move the X and Y axis by hand back and forth a few times full travel and see if they move smoothly and even both directions.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

There doesn't appear to be a heat-related or sticking-related issue, as I've powered down the unit for 12 hours and tried again, and get the same results.  I've printed a few two or three level test prints, and they seem to stick to the bed just fine.

I've tried ronsii's suggestion above, and as far as I can tell, both X and Y axis travel smoothly.  There's no obvious spot in the path where movement becomes significantly more difficult.

What I've noticed in a few more hours of troubleshooting is that when I'm using Pronterface to move the head along the Y-axis, I get frequent, but intermittent "stuttering", during which, the head moves far less than the intended distance.  It seems to be worse when I am moving the head 10mm, as opposed to the 100mm button, which typically seems pretty smooth, but also sometimes stutters significantly.

Also, the stuttering doesn't seem to occur at a specific point along the Y-axis.  It seems to happen more at the end of the rails closest to the front door, but not always.

I emailed support [at] solidoodle.com about this last night, but have had no response.  Does anyone know how long it normally takes to get a response from Solidoodle on this sort of thing?

Any thoughts or ideas would be appreciated, as I have to say, I'm a little disheartened so far.

Thanks.

-Solidoodle 2 Pro with glass bed and custom enclosure.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

I just had the same problem. It was the belts. I had to tinker with them for a good hour to remedy it.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Check the set screws in the pulleys in the back of the printer.  There should be three pulleys along the back, two connected to the long rod across the back and one on the y motor.  Solidoodle has a few videos and the circle alignment one will help make sure the belt tensions are correct.  If these don't help, the next step would be to wipe down the rods on the left and right to make sure there is no little bit of glue or plastic catching and then relube them.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

earhornjones wrote:

What I've noticed in a few more hours of troubleshooting is that when I'm using Pronterface to move the head along the Y-axis, I get frequent, but intermittent "stuttering", during which, the head moves far less than the intended distance.  It seems to be worse when I am moving the head 10mm, as opposed to the 100mm button, which typically seems pretty smooth, but also sometimes stutters significantly.

Have you tried moving the carriage around by hand, with the power off, to see if some portions of the travel are more difficult than others?  I have one guide rod that will only work in a specific orientation, else the increased friction causes binding that ruins prints.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

I've spent a few hours tweaking the tension on the Y-axis belts (by which I mean, randomly tightening and loosening them) and seem to have resolved the problem.  I found a belt tensioning gauge on Thingiverse, which I intend to print tonight so that I can ensure both belts are tightened equally, and will probably be performeing the "Perfect Circle Calibration" from the Solidoodle video over the weekend.

Thanks for all of the help, feedback and suggestions.  I've learned a great deal about how the Solidoodle works from the suggestions, and feel much more comfortable making adjustments.  I feel like I still have a fair way to go before I'm printing "well", but I am printing now!

Thanks again.

-Solidoodle 2 Pro with glass bed and custom enclosure.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Wow!  That's pretty severe.  I just had a problem similar to this but nowhere near as bad -- shifts of maybe 1/2 mm two or three times in a 25-layer print. 

I looked through the Solidoodle Google group for ideas as to the cause, and the one that struck home in my case was the filament hanging up.   From what I read, this can cause the motor to skip, leading to an offset.

Happens I just rotated the spindle from vertical to horizontal because filament was falling off the spool.  I suspect now that this change created extra resistance to unrolling the spool.  The Solidoodle is at our makerspace, so I won't be able to follow up on this till I get back there.

earhornjones wrote:

I just received my much anticipated Solidoodle today, and in running a few sample prints, there seems to be an issue with the layers lining up properly on top of the previous layer.  See the attached photo.

What causes this?

Can someone help?

Thanks,
EarhornJones

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

mine is similiar not as bad but I can not get that last 2mm dialed in. It is around the 5-6th layer everytime. i got it to hold by 9 but print is shot.

what I did:
Y video adjustment at least 3x
Adjusted the stepper voltages they were all low.
lubed the shafts
adjusted the back rod so it does not shift left or right (maybe 1mm) and set collars
then I realized belt tension is super critical but I find it so hard to believe it worked fine for weeks then wham loose and impossible to get back.
What have you found on a circle looking top down. I think if I see it pull or skip to the corner then I tighten that belt to pull it back in and reiterate.

I tried the loose slip video gimmick and felt super loose and great and gave worse prints.

then after trial and error for days I got it to where cal cubes will print but once infill is added it gets goofy and consinetely steps out

circles are worse I was able to get some squares to print ok but the have severe banding (not banding but every 1/2" it kicks out and reprints about 5mm forward) I redid my z wobble cal and found that was now totally off . That reset helped


but again what is the tension method for this dam thing do I go drum tight or super loose? should the the front belt section be looser or tighter then the back ? impossible to feel if both are same

I wish I got a machine that worked, I want to print not tweak this much

SD2 owner- Surestepr, filament holder,QUBD servo and heaters, glass bed
Print for fun and for parts for my sports cars
current car is 88 IROC

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

jj,

I feel your pain. I have expend hours trying to print the perfect circle and nothing has worked out yet. My voltages were also low (no idea how those could have changed after they tested and shipped the printer); and I even removed the Y rod to check if it was bend, but it wasn't. I asked customer support about a direct method to measure the belt tension, but they said just do trial and error. Lucky to those that got a great experience out of the box.

CB

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

elmoret wrote:

Skipping on the y-axis. Do a search.

Possible causes:
Belts not tightened evenly
Y-axis motor being under driven by stepper driver
Binding along the slide rails

Also, add in improper stepper chip voltages.

Former Solidoodle employee, no longer associated with the company.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

solidoodlesupport wrote:
elmoret wrote:

Skipping on the y-axis. Do a search.

Possible causes:
Belts not tightened evenly
Y-axis motor being under driven by stepper driver
Binding along the slide rails

Also, add in improper stepper chip voltages.

"Y-axis motor being under driven by stepper driver"

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Are you cleaning the rods with a paper towel before lubing them?

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Well I did all of the above and the problem just has made the printer useless for me I asked to return it this week. They said yes. It starts out with great prints then wham around layer 16 it goes to pot.

I did steppers at least 3x and have them dialed in
I removed the rods lubed them over dozen times and got the to flow freely
I have the tension in various forms of looseness.

I did finally get the problem to occur within the first few layers whihcis betterthen layer 18 and waiitng but it is same thing walk back in y
It occurred after I tension one side and not other.

So I think maybe I am too loose I will try one more time
steppers
belt tension
alignment.

I wish there was better specs for proper tension and alignment guide tool or something

SD2 owner- Surestepr, filament holder,QUBD servo and heaters, glass bed
Print for fun and for parts for my sports cars
current car is 88 IROC

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:38952

Ian made somethng that's on thingiverse, but if you're unable to print you won't be able to use this one.  You could however fashion something up similar with a paperclip and some tape.  At least then you know you have equal tension and take one thing out of the equation.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Can I suggest a check of the spool as well.
I had had flawless printing for months and then all of a sudden I was getting a shift on the Y axis, which then got worse and worse.
During my last print I could see the belt was jumping so I pulled the power to figure out what was going wrong. It was only when I tried to move the carriage forward by had that I found the problem was simply the filament had gone tight due to the spool getting itself in a bind.
Due to my set up it had somehow jumped off of the spool and wrapped itself round the spindle so it would feed for a bit the go tight, then feed and go tight. This would show up as the layers kept going backwards as the layers went up as it could go to the front with the filament like that.
This seems very much like you pictures.

The bit that got me to start with is that I was watching the belts and carriages but never thought to look at the extruder as it was still printing.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Hmm yes I thought of the filament but it seems to be loose and fine. you know to eliminate any doubt I should just cut a few meters off and print with no spool

SD2 owner- Surestepr, filament holder,QUBD servo and heaters, glass bed
Print for fun and for parts for my sports cars
current car is 88 IROC

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

I have had intermittent failures because one of my guide rods was not straight.  It would rotate when the printer was operating until it was at an angle that caused the carriage to jam.  I fixed this by rotating the rod until the carriage moved smoothly and then fixing it in place with the hose clamps on each end of the rod.  If you rotate one of the clamps all the way clockwise, and tighten it; and then rotate the other all the way counter clockwise, and tighten it; then the rod will not be able to rotate.  Might not have anything to do with your problem.

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Mine started out like this, and loosening the belts fixed it. It later came back after the front Y bearing holders cracked then snapped. Maybe check them aswell?

Cheers

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

you can print out extra Y brackets with this stl - http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:36446

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

Well new problem now
I thought I had it fixed after alignment and switch to glass bed. Which was night and day for level pritns, quality 1st layer starts stick etc. made a big differance for calibration very consitent

Well I amde 2 small prints nop problem and went for a big part. half way through 141 of 250 layers. machine stops frozen and shifted to front now not back (a first) whihc tells me maybe it was too much flow now or dragging?

Either way it appears board is fried? I can connect and turn heaters on/off but the RH shows all the m code values as 0? I tried reloading firmware and it loads up fine but all motors will not respond just heaters. I can send manual M92 codes then try to move and they all grind a little but basically seem broken?
WTF was this my problem all along a bad board?

SD2 owner- Surestepr, filament holder,QUBD servo and heaters, glass bed
Print for fun and for parts for my sports cars
current car is 88 IROC

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Re: Newbie Problem - Layers not aligning across Y-axis

What number are you setting your motor steps to with the M92?