Brim peeling but prints stick

**Quintox303** · 2015-04-01 23:42:41

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Topic: Brim peeling but prints stick

Ok so I've just switched to a new roll of filament and I had some problems with adhesion to the bed just using hairspray and glass so I decided to switch to the abs acetone slurry to see how that would go and now the actual prints stick really well but the brim starts to lift off the bed almost as soon as it is printed. The weird thing is though that it's lifting up on the inside and not on the outside. Then when it prints the solid infill on the first layer it is actually disconnected from the brim/loops that have lifted. I will post a picture if anyone can't understand what I mean. I have my bed temp at 100.

Does anyone know why this is happening and how I can fix it?

Thanks,
Matt

**jagowilson** · 2015-04-02 00:20:57

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

I have a lot of ideas but I can't suggest anything without some good pictures. If it happens almost instantly after the print starts - even a video might be revealing. I've had this happen but there are several causes.

**lueman** · 2015-04-02 00:30:12

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Sounds like bed level/calibration issues, when was the last time you checked bed height?? I use a flat edge razor with no safety edge, it's exactly .22 mm and i set my Z-Offset to -.14.

SD4 with E3D V6.

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**Quintox303** · 2015-04-02 00:40:36

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Ok thanks. I levelled my bed yesterday but I'll try again just to be sure and then I'll post a video if it doesn't work.

**Quintox303** · 2015-04-02 12:32:31

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Ok so here it is. I re levelled the bed and re applied the slurry. I've linked a video and attached a picture of what is happening. I bump up the flow rate on the first layer to 150% in RH so that the brim lines stick together. You can see in the video that the peeling of the brim happens in the back corners but mostly in the middle.

https://youtu.be/hNRIZnQR4Oc

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**IronMan** · 2015-04-02 15:49:37

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

If you've tried hairspray and then slurry and your bed temp is at 100c, then I would suspect your nozzle may not be close enough to the bed...

Also, was the hairspray the Aquanet brand?

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
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**Quintox303** · 2015-04-02 22:39:34

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

I'm not using Acquanet for the Hairspray. I don't know if I can get it here in
Australia. Maybe I should look for it online. The way I've been levelling my bed is by adjusting the front two screws until a sheet of paper starts to grip between the nozzle and the bed. Then I do the back screw and then make sure they are all even again. I also make sure that I do it when the bed is heated up.

**wardjr** · 2015-04-02 23:08:37

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

But what are you using for a first layer height?
Are you using a z-offset?
First layer should be the same as the other layers so .2963.
Don't use a z-offset and this means your first layer will end up being the thickness of that paper, not .2963

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
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**Quintox303** · 2015-04-03 00:41:02

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

I've just switched to Kisslicer and I've got my layer height set at 0.3 but I cant find a separate setting for first layer height. I haven't used a z-offset in the software before but I've calibrated the screw at the back.

**Quintox303** · 2015-04-03 00:59:06

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Ah yes. I think I understand what you're saying. If I don't set a z-offset in the software then the first layer will be printed at whatever height I have set as zero + 0.3mm, which is the thickness of the paper + 0.3mm. Paper is about 0.1mm thick so if i set my z-offset to -0.1mm then the first layer will be printed at 0.3mm, right?

**wardjr** · 2015-04-03 01:24:34

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Something like that but you'll want an actual first layer less than .3 to get good adhesion. It really should look like a flat ribbon going down.

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

**IronMan** · 2015-04-03 02:17:48

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Look for the ingredient "Acrylate Copolymer" in the hairspray...works wonders!

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

**lueman** · 2015-04-03 18:14:31

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Setting Z-offset to -.1 seems a little to low try -.14. I understand the paper trick works for a lot of people but to get consistent accurate results you need a consistent accurate measure/ruler that's why I use a flat razor,manufacturers set very consistent tolerances and you get very repeatable results. Again my #9 flat razor when I remove the safety is about .22 mm so in my case I know to leave a -.14mm gap in z-offset (.3mm layer height - .22mm z-gap = .08mm) I add in a .06mm margin or there isn't enough room for the filament to come out, and yes sometimes even then I get some brim lift but my part is solidly anchored.

If yo are going to continue your way then I would turn the z-offset screw a 1/4 turn up so once homed Z- is set a little closer to the bed

SD4 with E3D V6.

Those who don't know ask, those who don't care comment, those who comment without answers hide ignorance for fear of asking. Be fearless!

**Quintox303** · 2015-04-04 06:20:59

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Thanks everyone for everything. I changed the z offset and got a new hairspray and it works a charm!

**wardjr** · 2015-04-04 13:55:31

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Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Glad to hear our advice works on the other side of the world.

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

Brim peeling but prints stick

Posts: 15

1 Topic by Quintox303 2015-04-01 23:42:41 (edited by Quintox303 2015-04-01 23:43:25)

Topic: Brim peeling but prints stick

2 Reply by jagowilson 2015-04-02 00:20:57 (edited by jagowilson 2015-04-02 00:21:11)

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

3 Reply by lueman 2015-04-02 00:30:12

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

4 Reply by Quintox303 2015-04-02 00:40:36

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

5 Reply by Quintox303 2015-04-02 12:32:31

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

6 Reply by IronMan 2015-04-02 15:49:37

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

7 Reply by Quintox303 2015-04-02 22:39:34 (edited by Quintox303 2015-04-02 22:40:15)

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

8 Reply by wardjr 2015-04-02 23:08:37

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

9 Reply by Quintox303 2015-04-03 00:41:02 (edited by Quintox303 2015-04-03 00:42:23)

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

10 Reply by Quintox303 2015-04-03 00:59:06 (edited by Quintox303 2015-04-03 01:21:53)

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

11 Reply by wardjr 2015-04-03 01:24:34

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

12 Reply by IronMan 2015-04-03 02:17:48

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

13 Reply by lueman 2015-04-03 18:14:31

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

14 Reply by Quintox303 2015-04-04 06:20:59

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

15 Reply by wardjr 2015-04-04 13:55:31

Re: Brim peeling but prints stick

Posts: 15