1 Topic by blarz

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Topic: Lawsy Carriages questions

I think my stock carriage is starting to wear out, it's starting to get a little bit of play in the carriage area. I have looked around at the forums and think that Lawsy has the best way for me to correct this problem on my printer. I do however have some questions about what is needed and what I should be doing before I start this project off. I already have the carriages printed out, have the bearings, and some extra hardware. I have an SD3 with the sanguine board.

1). Can you use the original extruder with the new carriage? (upgrade is down the road eventually)
2). How do you know when your belts are tensioned properly? (follow the guides? do the guides allow for new the different carriage?)
3). Can the original rods be used or do I need to go buy new ones?
4). Do I need to make a trip to the local hardware store for new nuts, bolts, washer etc or can they all be scavenged from the existing carriage?
5). What kinds and types of problems should I be aware of before starting this? (I have read through some forums but some questions are kind of leading, just looking for clarification)
6). Is there software modifications I need to make after modification?
7). Feel free to add questions and or answers to things I may have over looked.


Any and all help is greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

SD3/SD4 Mods completed: glass bed, changed zrod to 5mm, slop nut, aluminum arm-originally wood, plexi-glass case, Z Wobble Preventer,  Lawsy Carriages, X\Y motor fans, control board fans, extruder cartridge heater, MK5, Esd Lite
Mods working on:Direct Y Drive
Remember.......All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be....Pink Floyd...Dark Side of the Moon.

2 Reply by wardjr (edited by wardjr 2015-01-11 18:35:19)

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

blarz wrote:

I think my stock carriage is starting to wear out, it's starting to get a little bit of play in the carriage area. I have looked around at the forums and think that Lawsy has the best way for me to correct this problem on my printer. I do however have some questions about what is needed and what I should be doing before I start this project off. I already have the carriages printed out, have the bearings, and some extra hardware. I have an SD3 with the sanguine board.

1). Can you use the original extruder with the new carriage? (upgrade is down the road eventually)
Yes
2). How do you know when your belts are tensioned properly? (follow the guides? do the guides allow for new the different carriage?)
All you can do is get the y-axis belts equal then use some judgement.  You don't want them flopping around or so tight that something breaks.
3). Can the original rods be used or do I need to go buy new ones?
You'll need new ones that are of better quality and tolerance.
4). Do I need to make a trip to the local hardware store for new nuts, bolts, washer etc or can they all be scavenged from the existing carriage?
You should be able to get by with what you have but extras are nice just in case.
5). What kinds and types of problems should I be aware of before starting this? (I have read through some forums but some questions are kind of leading, just looking for clarification)
This mod is fairly straight forward the hardest part is cutting the new rods.
6). Is there software modifications I need to make after modification?
No
7). Feel free to add questions and or answers to things I may have over looked.
Seems like you've got it covered pretty well.


Any and all help is greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

Sorry for the buried responses I'm responding from my phone.

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

wardjr's Website

3 Reply by AZERATE

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

Personally, I would recommend getting a few more LM8UU bearings than you need. A lot of people report a few in each package that were unusable.
Also, grab some M3 nuts, washers, and screws just in case. Gravity was not on my side when I upgraded smile

http://www.mcmaster.com/ has great rods. You will need 8mm for the X and Y rods, and a 6mm if you want to swap out the drive rod while you are at it.

Printit Mason and Printit Horizon printers
Multiple SD2s- Bulldog XL, E3D v5/v6/Lite6, Volcano, Hobb Goblin, Titan, .9 motor, Lawsy carriages, direct Y drive, fishing line...the list goes on
Filawinder and Filastruder #1870.....worth every penny!

4 Reply by blarz

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

Yes have a lot of lm8uu bearings, what type of rods am I looking for? I know they're 8mm but they have quite a few choices of the types of rods.

SD3/SD4 Mods completed: glass bed, changed zrod to 5mm, slop nut, aluminum arm-originally wood, plexi-glass case, Z Wobble Preventer,  Lawsy Carriages, X\Y motor fans, control board fans, extruder cartridge heater, MK5, Esd Lite
Mods working on:Direct Y Drive
Remember.......All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be....Pink Floyd...Dark Side of the Moon.

5 Reply by jagowilson

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

blarz wrote:

Yes have a lot of lm8uu bearings, what type of rods am I looking for? I know they're 8mm but they have quite a few choices of the types of rods.

I used hardened steel but stainless steel is another choice. Hardened steel is relatively cheap and pretty strong so I recommend it. Make sure you get a SHAFT and not a ROD. Rods are of poorer tolerances than shafts.

6 Reply by blarz

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

By chance does anyone have the measurements needed written down someplace, in SAE non metric...lol. I don't want to totally scrap the one I'm replacing, I'd like to keep the old one as a spare part, maybe somethign to work something new with.

SD3/SD4 Mods completed: glass bed, changed zrod to 5mm, slop nut, aluminum arm-originally wood, plexi-glass case, Z Wobble Preventer,  Lawsy Carriages, X\Y motor fans, control board fans, extruder cartridge heater, MK5, Esd Lite
Mods working on:Direct Y Drive
Remember.......All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be....Pink Floyd...Dark Side of the Moon.

7 Reply by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2015-01-14 22:27:01)

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

If you put in SAE rods your lm8uus will be worthless. The rod will either be too big or too small...

If you're referring to length, get something longer than you need and cut it.

8 Reply by n2ri

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

I thought old rods/shafts could be re-used if you can cut old carriages loose from them clean?

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

9 Reply by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2015-01-14 22:42:27)

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

n2ri wrote:

I thought old rods/shafts could be re-used if you can cut old carriages loose from them clean?

sure, but the ones on the printer are junk compared to what you can buy 3rd party. right now im using my bent-as-hell stock x rods on my x axis. I broke away the old carriages pretty easily with just one whack of a hammer. They're printed at like... 30% infill, so obviously the carriages didn't survive.

10 Reply by blarz

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

No no no, you misunderstand what I meant. I have the 8mm shafts from mccaster, they came in the next day. I know how to gauge the length of the top two rails, but I was hoping someone had the measurements of the length they need to be cut to for the carriage rails.

SD3/SD4 Mods completed: glass bed, changed zrod to 5mm, slop nut, aluminum arm-originally wood, plexi-glass case, Z Wobble Preventer,  Lawsy Carriages, X\Y motor fans, control board fans, extruder cartridge heater, MK5, Esd Lite
Mods working on:Direct Y Drive
Remember.......All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be....Pink Floyd...Dark Side of the Moon.

11 Reply by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2015-01-15 21:38:11)

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

280mm but tbey don't have to be precise. That measurement comes from Lawsy's instructions so I take no responsibility if it's wrong. wink

12 Reply by wardjr

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

jagowilson wrote:

280mm but tbey don't have to be precise. That measurement comes from Lawsy's instructions so I take no responsibility if it's wrong. wink

That sounds right but they are the same length as the stock rods so just measure those.

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

wardjr's Website

13 Reply by blarz

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

Hey silly question but, Has anyone tried anything like this for the z axis? Besides the finer threaded z-rod?

SD3/SD4 Mods completed: glass bed, changed zrod to 5mm, slop nut, aluminum arm-originally wood, plexi-glass case, Z Wobble Preventer,  Lawsy Carriages, X\Y motor fans, control board fans, extruder cartridge heater, MK5, Esd Lite
Mods working on:Direct Y Drive
Remember.......All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be....Pink Floyd...Dark Side of the Moon.

14 Reply by Quintox303

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

I'm looking to do this upgrade very soon as soon as I get my e3d sorted out. I live in Australia and I'm fairly sure that mcmaster don't deliver here. I've already got my LM8UU's and some spare m3 screws.

I've replaced one of my rods in the past after I realised that my glass bed wasn't warped but the stock shaft was severely bent. I went to a local stainless steel shop and got them to cut me a rod there. Probably not the most reliable place for a precision shaft haha.

Anyway I'm wondering if anyone knows any other place that I could get some high quality shafts like the ones that mcmaster sells. Any help would be great.

Thanks,  Matt

15 Reply by veehoo

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

Quintox303 wrote:

I'm looking to do this upgrade very soon as soon as I get my e3d sorted out. I live in Australia and I'm fairly sure that mcmaster don't deliver here. I've already got my LM8UU's and some spare m3 screws.

I've replaced one of my rods in the past after I realised that my glass bed wasn't warped but the stock shaft was severely bent. I went to a local stainless steel shop and got them to cut me a rod there. Probably not the most reliable place for a precision shaft haha.

Anyway I'm wondering if anyone knows any other place that I could get some high quality shafts like the ones that mcmaster sells. Any help would be great.

Thanks,  Matt

I'm in the same situation, in that mcmaster is not an option. In ebay there's some 8mm shafts available, and these are for RepRap Prusa. Can't link directly for some reason, but you'll find them on ebay with a search like "Prusa i3 Rework Single Sheet Frame T8 Rod 8mm Smooth Rods Rail Bar Linear Shaft".

There's 6 usable shafts (i.e. long enough, need to be cut in length) for around $35,- Seems reasonable, wonder if anybody has any experiences?

veehoo

16 Reply by Quintox303

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

Thanks for your help. The forum has an anti spam rule that only allows users to post links after 10 or so posts.

17 Reply by blarz

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

Looking to add bearings to the bed arm, working on a print but it's rather large as I'm currently working it for a 18"x18"x24" printer, I will upload it to Thingerverse when I get it finished correctly. Have had issues with getting lm8uu bearings to fit. Finally got an answer on another post about sizing issues. doing 3rd print now. Here's a pic of part of the bed.

http://soliforum.com/i/?5trkBWa.jpg

It's a work in progress but trying to think of a way to add the slop nut to it. It's a 15:35hr print so it's a pain....Also it will have to be printed in pieces since it's going to be so large, even if it's a print for an sd3.

SD3/SD4 Mods completed: glass bed, changed zrod to 5mm, slop nut, aluminum arm-originally wood, plexi-glass case, Z Wobble Preventer,  Lawsy Carriages, X\Y motor fans, control board fans, extruder cartridge heater, MK5, Esd Lite
Mods working on:Direct Y Drive
Remember.......All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be....Pink Floyd...Dark Side of the Moon.

18 Reply by TheBaron

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

If you're having trouble getting 8mm rod, try searching for "drill rods". They're the hardened steel rods that people make custom drill bits with so the tolerances are pretty tight. a 36" rod should be in the $10-12 range.

SD3 w/ RUMBA (8825s), merlin hot end (in pieces). Ender3 w/ silent board for PLA printing. Ender5 w/ silent board, e3d v6, new z lead screw, and glass bed. DiY Kossel w/ smoothieboard (in pieces). Vellman Vertex (in pieces)
Shapeoko2 router in process of being converted to laser engraver (in pieces)
Multicam 5000 series CNC Router w/ 11HP spindle, 5x10' table, and auto tool changer (in pieces)

19 Reply by mdrVB6

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

TheBaron wrote:

If you're having trouble getting 8mm rod, try searching for "drill rods". They're the hardened steel rods that people make custom drill bits with so the tolerances are pretty tight. a 36" rod should be in the $10-12 range.


This is not good advice.  A "drill rod" is typically of a looser tolerance than a "hardened steel shaft".  There is a reason drill rods are a lot cheaper.  If you look on McMaster you can see the tolerance of an 8mm drill rod is +/- 0.013 or +/- 0.025mm depending on type while the tolerance of a hardened steel shaft is -0.009 to +0.000mm.  Any + deviation is going to cause grinding, hard motion or binding on your bearings and therefore print errors.

I do not recommend ordering drill rod instead of hardened steel shaft just because it is cheaper.  I have bought hardened steel shafts from McMaster and Folger tech with good results.

SD4 w/ RUMBA, E3D Volcano, all bearings, glass bed

20 Reply by TheBaron

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

mdrVB6 wrote:

If you look on McMaster you can see the tolerance of an 8mm drill rod is +/- 0.013 or +/- 0.025mm depending on type while the tolerance of a hardened steel shaft is -0.009 to +0.000mm.

Thank you, I did not notice that. I wasn't looking at tolerances, just thinking of other stuff around the shop that comes in 8mm and is pretty hard and straight. Stupid me!

SD3 w/ RUMBA (8825s), merlin hot end (in pieces). Ender3 w/ silent board for PLA printing. Ender5 w/ silent board, e3d v6, new z lead screw, and glass bed. DiY Kossel w/ smoothieboard (in pieces). Vellman Vertex (in pieces)
Shapeoko2 router in process of being converted to laser engraver (in pieces)
Multicam 5000 series CNC Router w/ 11HP spindle, 5x10' table, and auto tool changer (in pieces)

21 Reply by blarz

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Re: Lawsy Carriages questions

I used, hardened steel shafts from McMaster Carr.

I am working on designing a new larger print bed holder for a larger printer that I'm working on from scratch. Dimensions should come out to be about 18"x18"x18"/20".

Currently printing out pieces for the gantry controls on it. Have to finish up the bed holder itself and reprint it, seen a few things I did not like in the print.

SD3/SD4 Mods completed: glass bed, changed zrod to 5mm, slop nut, aluminum arm-originally wood, plexi-glass case, Z Wobble Preventer,  Lawsy Carriages, X\Y motor fans, control board fans, extruder cartridge heater, MK5, Esd Lite
Mods working on:Direct Y Drive
Remember.......All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be....Pink Floyd...Dark Side of the Moon.