Odd circle test results (Page 15 of 24)

stop your scaring me from doing mods on my SD2 lol
Im so glad I didnt start 3D printing with an SD4 with lots of issues. I would have abandoned 3D printing long ago already. now I think all my issues were tiny in comparison.

This is not true. Dimensions are the same, yes, but they have different pulley brackets, screw sizes and lengths, even the idler bearing is a different size. The extruder is obviously different as well as the placement of the electronics.

Most of these wouldn't necessarily give you different printing results, but comparing the extruder to that of the 2/3 Jigsaw or MK5 is like comparing Italian and Spanish languages. They have some similar aspects, but each have their own twist.

Yeah, I worded that pretty badly.
My point was, I don't see any difference on these two printers which could have effect on the print quality.
Same belts used, same motors, same diameter and length rods, almost identical carriage with two bushings on one side and two teflons on the other, same frame holding all this, same firmware, same software...
And the pillow bushing which was added in SD4 has surprisingly little effect in my tests.

I don't think things like different extruder, hose clamps instead of shaft collars, Sanguinololu motherboard instead of Printrboard or RUMBA and slightly different idler pulleys could have such a dramatic effect on print quality.

But then again it's hard for me to believe that out of 11 people who have ran this test so far I counted all 8 Solidoodle 4's have had this issue and the 3 Solidoodle 3's print just fine and this is not a Solidoodle 4 issue.

Only thing I can think of is switching to different rod manufacturer and these ones bending more and resulting in binding before you can get rid of backlash, but how likely is that?

I finally got around to checking diameter:
McMaster - 6.00mm  straight across measuring every 1" or so. Perfect.
Solidoodle - 6.02mm at best. Some spots were 6.13mm. With gouges, dings, and spurs, this is only usable if I sand it down.

To clarify, I had no intention to use the SD rod. I never had the need to swap the Y drive rod from my SD2 after the carriage upgrade. The stock rods in the printer I bought one year ago are actually good quality. Since I didn't swap rods, I had a McMaster rod that has been laying around for a few months. Since I am assembling a new SD2 and I needed parts, I reflected on this thread wondering why the newer models are having problems more often. So I decided to order some rods without the intention of using them just to check quality.

Also, SD only sent me one pully with a large enough inner diameter to fit the rod in. The rest were for the front and steppers. This was an admitted mistake of an SD employee, and Daniel was more than happy to send out new ones that he already test fit on a rod.
On that topic, but as a side note from the thread, I must say I was very happy with the experience I got from the SD staff the last week. They fixed a problem with shipping, went above and beyond to rectify the situation, and are still happy to fix errors. Edrick and Daniel were very easy to work with.

the SD4 has other addons from SD3 also like the exhaust fan vent in rear housing, which has been carryed over to the WB Apprentice as with prev models using past features. some even though not tested/proven as good upgrades

I'm personally pretty bad with using calipers. The back rod and side rods on which the carriage slides seemed to be mostly 4-5 mm thinner than needed, but don't take my word for it.
Though it would explain why this is happening:

The bushings have larger holes than the rod diameter is, so it has room for a little play. It does go away after tightening the belts though.

So AZERATE, do you know of any way you could compare the stiffness of the the poor quality new rod you got and the good old one?

Please keep the comments constructive instead of destructive. We are all very dedicated to solving the problem which is why threads like this exist.

This thread has become a spitball of ideas because a solution hasn't surfaced. Thus, it I s important to give responses which prove or disprove them.

I know you are only trying to help and if you had a link to solve our problems, you'd have provided it already. Thanks again.

yeah figured the 2 of you would post together. we know whos who.
and yes these 2 topics are exactly the same issue with perfect circle problems on mostly SD4 and it has been solved. you just refuse to fix your own or try anything, instead annoying others with same requests just to see how many pages you can string this out so nobody will take the time to read and see how to solve theirs. good luck finding anyone to offer help kid.

as to the rechecking over and over thats just crazy. and for you all to accuse anyone else of not helping with suggestions/fixes. LMAO maybe you should try it 1st, as none of your alias's have posted even 1 useful thing to try or shown anything in the form of positive repairs you have done. only negative responses, repeated questions etc. why dont you close all the old user accounts and just start 1 called 'Noid' so we know who your talking as that way you wont accidentally comment under the wrong name and try deleting it b4 anyone notices. while your at it put your printer info in signature and some location on the Earth your from in profile instead of trying to hide.

as for "Going back to the topic I think it should be our first priority to just check if the newer rods are less stiff. If it's just a problem with the back rod than the solution for everyone might just be replacing the back rod"

yes you do that and let us know what you find. because others already did and posted it more than once if you would reread the 40 or so pages in 2 topics on the matter. move on to  something else already this horse/bush has been beaten to death.

oh who said anything about those names?

I'm just listing the users in this forum who have this problem. We're all one person??
The fact that one of us has switched to rumba and the other still has the kapton tape on under the glass could be a hint for you.

Since they are talking about it, obviously the issue isn't solved for them. And all of us beating a "dead horse" when the solution is there according to your claims is very unlikely.
Look, we can make a photo of our printer's ID. Will you stop with this nonsense then?

Answer my questions instead. Where's the solution you claim already exists?? Nobody cares about your conspiracy theories.

*facepalm*
Me saying something might fix the problem doesn't make it a god damn solution to the problem. (and I'm not even sure, I posted me theory to discuss it with others)
And jagowilson saying linear bearings might fix the problem doesn't make it a solution to the problem.
Both of these might a solution, but we don't know. And until we do, it's called a theory.
And us knowing these might be a solution to the problem and discussing more isn't the definition of "beating a dead horse".

Oh, and add Claghorn to the list of people with this issue.

Finally, I'm using commas where I have to because I know a thing or two about punctuation. Check everyone else's posts and then compare to yours. You not using any commas in your sentences and having few line sentences makes it painful to read.

As I've said already,

Otherwise, you haven't made any constructive post yourself and just made accusations and made fun of my poor skills.

Bullshit.

No problem there for me.

Jagowilson has.
My own bearings are on the way, because even if it doesn't fix this issue completely it looks way better replacement.

Yes. But I don't remember being asked that.

What about them? Stronger front idlers? Then yes.

There you go.

Exactly, so stop coming into threads and posting offtopic counter-productive ad-hominem attacks and spam and ridiculing others.

And for many, it hasn't worked for them and that is why we are still discussing! Let us discuss and leave us alone, jeez.

I've replaced my carriage, my belts, my front idlers, tried the spring mod and not to mention all the suggestions from the Solidoodle Help Center.
And who the hell are you to tell me I'm not trying hard enough??

nbourg8 told you this several posts back.

As he said, there is no solution. There are suggestions on what might be the solution. There's a difference between a solution and suggestion, as I've explained already. I have even provided my own (unlike you). And we are free to discuss the proposed solutions. You have no right to come here and post off-topic attacks against anyone.

OK, I haven't posted on this thread before, but I did read (most of) it.  First of all, it indeed beats a dead horse.  You are making lots of assumptions about what might be wrong, but are unwilling to try any of the fixes that have already been posted.

Secondly, it would appear that most of the SD4 printers can print a fairly decent circle to start with, and you're spending more time printing silly circles, that printing anything useful or fun.  How often do you really need to print a perfect large circle?

Those of us with SD3 printers had pretty horrible printouts out of the box, which is what forced us to try different fixes to at least make our circles look like circles.  When we got close, we moved on.

As n2ri said, these are unique machines, with their own character, there is no single solution.  Yes someone's solution may work for others, but not all.  So the is no ONE SOLUTION to rule them all.

You guys are making it sound as if you're looking for the holy grail, but all you're doings going around incircles, complaining that the sky is falling and waiting for some miracle.

Go out there and make something.  Show us some of your creativity, show us some of your contributions to this hobby (and this forum).  Andstop complaining about the smallest things.

Ultimately if this SD4 printer is not to your liking, maybe you should buy a different one.

FYI, the circle problem is inherent to printers that use a XY gantry, meaning it has the printhead moves in both direction on the same plane.  Printers that move the print surface front to back for the "Y", and print head side to side for the "X", don't have this problem.  If printing "the perfect circle" is your ultimate goal, maybe you should look for one of those printers.

Edit:
To put your mind to ease, I did replace the back 6mm rod with stronger one from McMaster-Carr, but it didn't make much difference, I also put a pillow block with support bearings, it made no difference either.  FOR ME, it was the backlash in the small motor belt that solved my problem.  That's not today that would work for everyone, it probably won't, but at least I came up with something, rather than complained incessantly, hoping that someone else would fix it for me.