1 Topic by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2014-10-09 07:15:08)

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Topic: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

Hey folks, 

I bought my Solidoodlee about 3 weeks ago and things have been going well (although leaving the extruder idle too long clogged it up badly and I'm waiting on a new one).

Anyway, in working with the hot end to unclog it I bumped the fan on the left side of the extruder motor and took a few blades off. I currently have its power disconnected and am waiting on a couple ball bearing fans.

How essential is this fan really, though? I've attached a picture from the day I got my SD4 (notice the clean build plate), and I didn't realize it until now, but the fan casing has been damaged since day 1 (likely from shipping). So I imagine it's had a rattle that's been impacting my print quality, but I haven't noticed.

So, worth replacing or not? Fan I bought has 3 wires and I've never crimped before so I don't know how to put a 2 pin QD connector on. I also *really* don't want to rebundle all those wires.

Advice please? Thanks.

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2 Reply by trinium42

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

As I understand it the fan keeps each layer cooling and prevents warping so its probably good to have it around. Is there anyway I could get a closeup on your extruder gear? is straight across teeth or is shallow in the middle? Im asking because I cant get mine to feed consitently

3 Reply by jagowilson

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

You're in luck. My extruder is all apart right now as I await a new hotend. Yes, it is sunken in the middle and this is how it is supposed to be.

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4 Reply by jagowilson

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

Also if that is the fan's only purpose, then that is fine. I'll run without it for a while and see how things go. I'll wait for a few more replies. I definitely don't want to do any damage out of laziness/unwilingness to buy a crimper.

5 Reply by IronMan

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

I believe the primary purpose of that fan is to cool the extruder stepper motor.  Nozzle fans (for cooling printed layers) are usually mounted with a holder / shroud which directs the air around the entire nozzle.  Many options for those on Thingiverse.

So, if you choose to run without, keep a very close eye on the stepper overheating; but I would not run without it for the long term...with that in mind, you might want to learn how to crimp!

BTW, when you do switch it out, watch out for polarity when hooking up the new fan.  Wiring it in reverse will kill it.

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6 Reply by elmoret

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

The side fan is for cooling the filament. The fan on the back is for cooling the stepper.

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7 Reply by IronMan

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

My bad...guess I have not been keeping up as much as I should on the newer models tongue I'll hold off commenting until I upgrade my knowledge base!...Glad to see they now come with the filament cooler already on!!

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8 Reply by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2014-10-06 18:01:14)

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

What negative side effects will I experience without filament cooling? As you can see in the picture, the fan casing has been damaged since day 1 so my cooling has probably been sub optimal this whole time.

I won't be printing for God knows how long. Solidoodle support denied the existence of my clogged extruder, and I couldn't unclog it myself, so I'm stuck waiting on a new hotend. They sent me a tracking # but USPS says they haven't even received the package yet. Solidoodle has been silent on all inquiries about my order now. I am very unhappy. The printer works great, and I don't mind tinkering with stuff to achieve perfection, but the lackluster support and documentation makes this the most expensive, unsupported piece of equipment I've ever purchased, which is a shame, because I love 3d printing now and there's no way I can live without one now. I'd get an e3d, but I need to print parts for it I think, and at the moment I'm not willing to drop another cent until this thing works. All the folks about to buy the press who think Solidoodle are going to help them out of troubles are in for a world of heartache. That's why I'm glad this forum exists.

The machines are great, but I shouldn't be mad at a company that makes a product that gives me such joy. And yes, I will learn to crimp.

Edit: by the way, this article is very misleading and resulted in me ruining my extruder because it made me set my extrusion temp too cold (215C is the recommendation on the SD4, but good luck finding that anywhere but the FAQ and Repetier defaults):http://wiki.solidoodle.com/things-not-to-do

Edit2: Support got back to me. Now it just has to get here...

9 Reply by jagowilson

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

IronMan wrote:

I believe the primary purpose of that fan is to cool the extruder stepper motor.  Nozzle fans (for cooling printed layers) are usually mounted with a holder / shroud which directs the air around the entire nozzle.  Many options for those on Thingiverse.

So, if you choose to run without, keep a very close eye on the stepper overheating; but I would not run without it for the long term...with that in mind, you might want to learn how to crimp!

BTW, when you do switch it out, watch out for polarity when hooking up the new fan.  Wiring it in reverse will kill it.

Good to know... A lot of DC motors just spin in reverse if polarity is reversed, in my experience.

10 Reply by elmoret

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

That is true for brushed DC motors, not true for brushless.

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11 Reply by IronMan

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

jagowilson wrote:

What negative side effects will I experience without filament cooling? As you can see in the picture, the fan casing has been damaged since day 1 so my cooling has probably been sub optimal this whole time.

The filament cooling comes in handy for PLA in general, and printing ABS at .1 layer height on smaller parts or parts with small areas that extend upward.

Printing in ABS at .3mm height(what I typically do) generally does not require cooling except for the thin "mountain peaks" or the tips of Yoda's ears, etc.

I've had a fan and mount sitting under my workbench for almost a year and a half smile

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12 Reply by jagowilson

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

The poor airflow from the damaged case may explain the issues I've had with separation of fillets on small parts even with a ridiculous number of perimeters. Hmm. Well, I'll install this new fan when I get the hotend and see how it goes. By the way, is crimping actually the technique I'll need to install the QD connectors after I cut the yellow wire, or are the wires soldered in somehow? I plan on taking the QD off the old fan and using it, but I honestly have no idea what I'm doing, and being partially visually impaired is certainly contributing to my frustration in this task.

13 Reply by IronMan

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

Can you post a close-up photo of the connector?

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14 Reply by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2014-10-07 00:13:09)

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

The new fan hasn't come yet, but it is just like this except with 3 pins, not 2. I couldn't find a fan with a long enough lead that didn't have 3 pins.This picture is the connector on the current fan in the SD4.

The fan I have coming is much nicer than the current one. I'm also replacing the case fan because it rattles for a while. Sleeve bearings are garbage.

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15 Reply by jagowilson

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

I wonder too, could I somehow splice the fan into the wire coming up to the old fan? What is the safest way to do this? Last thing I want to do is short the board and totally hose the printer.

16 Reply by IronMan

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

I've never had to replace one, but those seem like a "press-in" vampire tap style that cuts through the insulation when you press the wires in.

Someone who has done it please chime in here...

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17 Reply by jagowilson

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

That would be nice, and would save me money on a crimper or soldering iron.

18 Reply by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2014-10-07 03:07:48)

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

I found out what I need. I'll verify the size with a caliper on the current connectors, and I'll try to find them on McMaster-Carr for a better deal  http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B004GUQ2Z … ot_redir=1

I am still curious about a safe way to splice wires, because I'll still have to do this for the E3D, no? To hook up the extra fan. Appreciate the help folks. You guys are awesome for real.

Edit: McMaster Carr page: http://www.mcmaster.com/#component-connectors/=u1i16p Under "compact push-in connectors". Hopefully this is right. ~$2 for 10 is a mistake I'm willing to make.

19 Reply by grob

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

jagowilson wrote:

I am still curious about a safe way to splice wires, because I'll still have to do this for the E3D, no? To hook up the extra fan.

Jump in! Red to red, black to black. smile

I cut and soldered mine, using heatshrink tubing to finish it. This is a strong and not-so-bulky joint. I taped it to the side of the extruder motor (with the other cables) to support it.

If you're tinkering with a 3d printer, I'd guess that at some point you're going to want to solder something. Well worth the small outlay and learning. Yes you can burn yourself, but it's no more dangerous than your printer's hot end...

Otherwise someone might be able to recommend a tool-free crimp thing; I haven't really looked into this...

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20 Reply by elmoret

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

jagowilson wrote:

I am still curious about a safe way to splice wires, because I'll still have to do this for the E3D, no? To hook up the extra fan. Appreciate the help folks. You guys are awesome for real.

E3D comes with wire splices, called ferrules.

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21 Reply by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2014-10-07 12:08:02)

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

Y

grob wrote:
jagowilson wrote:

I am still curious about a safe way to splice wires, because I'll still have to do this for the E3D, no? To hook up the extra fan.

Jump in! Red to red, black to black. smile

I cut and soldered mine, using heatshrink tubing to finish it. This is a strong and not-so-bulky joint. I taped it to the side of the extruder motor (with the other cables) to support it.

If you're tinkering with a 3d printer, I'd guess that at some point you're going to want to solder something. Well worth the small outlay and learning. Yes you can burn yourself, but it's no more dangerous than your printer's hot end...

Otherwise someone might be able to recommend a tool-free crimp thing; I haven't really looked into this...

Not worried about burning myself and I have soldered before, but as I mentioned previously I am visually impaired and could mess up without realizing and potentially damage components. Sadly none of my friends know how to solder, I'm probably the most technically capable out of all the people I know... even amongst my fellow phd students... You'd be amazed how non-handy Comp Sci students are.

I will probably go the ferrule route, because actually after doing some measurements, I can't find those bloody molex connectors anywhere. 0.02210 in length, didn't measure height, but googling turned up nothing. Yay. Gonna drive over to radio shack and see what I can find after I finish my research work for the day. Fans will definitely get here today so might as well install them.

22 Reply by jagowilson (edited by jagowilson 2014-10-09 07:15:32)

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

Fixed. Crimped some butt splices to put it all together. Won't post a picture because it's ugly as sin, but as long as it works, I don't care. It will probably fall apart from motion over time, but whatever.

23 Reply by AOYOU3D

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

The fan on the back of the extruder motor is used to cool that motor,
The side fan is for cooling the filament and the front of the motor,
If you think you need the third one to cool PLA prints near by a nozzle,
You have to make a holder, and mount it to X carriage.

24 Reply by n2ri

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

also lack of that fan will make a repeat of burning filament in extruder more likely than b4 and can ruin extruder especially if PLA is inside. many posts on here of leaving it hot and idle being bad

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25 Reply by n2ri (edited by n2ri 2014-10-26 05:45:11)

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Re: How crucial is this extruder fan on the SD4

"Anyway, in working with the hot end to unclog it I bumped the fan on the left side of the extruder motor and took a few blades off."

Bumped? LOL, by the picture it looks like it was hit with an iron bar and busted both sides of fan housing also. reports of poor packing by SD have shown printers lately being sent with bed all the way up causing Z stop switch to bend and items on top of bed that can bang/rub on printer parts so yes likely fan had damage from that. search for topics on Z stop switch bent issues and missing bushing in pivot on fhe arm for spring tension on filament feed to see if yours has those issues also.

my brother inlaw bumped the 30mm fan blade on rear of my SD2 extruder with finger while it was running and all it done is made it whine a bit since and its now barely audible when on like a distant mosquito. likely chipped a blade (b4 it made no sound). I dont think those fans have ball bearings either. they spin similar to a CD/DVD disc drive. these are delicate machines just like most small office machines. and that extruder can overheat causing damage to itself, printer and start fires on nearby materials at the temps they can reach. as another topic discuses. be very careful and safety aware when using a 3D printer as with other tools that have various hazards associated.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs