1 Topic by WhiteStar01 (edited by WhiteStar01 2013-11-09 18:16:09)

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Topic: Uneven Layers/Gaps

Hey Guys- could you offer me your thoughts on my current layer gap issue.  For the most part- I have got the printer dialed in (over a year of printing) but I just can't seem to cross that threshold from decent prints, to great ones.  This is at 0.3 (0.3457 in Slic3r)   mm layer height with Solidoodle filament.  I always seem to get small gaps/uneven layers in my print- despite my attempts to get the calibration just right.

Disregard the top object- that's my extruder fan duct wink

Settings: Extruder 195
Enclosure used
Same results with and without fan
Calibration done with this filament
Infill 0.1 rectilinear
Infill every layer
Speeds- all slower than default (basically)
Extrusion Width- All zeros
Filament 1.72- verified currently with whats entering printer





Any thoughts?

Cheers

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2 Reply by techbuilder2175

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

Looks like banding
have you upgraded the z axis rod?

Powder coated steel enclosure, 1/4" Surface grounded hardened aluminum plate, MK2A Heat bed, .200 Polished fused quartz plate, Machined quick change hot bed mount, E3D hot end, Ramps 1.4, DRV8825 stepper motor drivers

3 Reply by WhiteStar01

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

No updated rod- just the added nut/cap.  It does look a bit like banding- but is not consistent at all.  I'm at a loss.

My gut feeling was the filament is varying in diameter- which I have measure a bit, but the amount of change is quite small.

4 Reply by techbuilder2175

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

Print a rod
2n2r5 uses this to verify any banding

here's the post
http://www.soliforum.com/topic/3691/met … ew/page/3/

Powder coated steel enclosure, 1/4" Surface grounded hardened aluminum plate, MK2A Heat bed, .200 Polished fused quartz plate, Machined quick change hot bed mount, E3D hot end, Ramps 1.4, DRV8825 stepper motor drivers

5 Reply by WhiteStar01

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

I didn't see his file- but here are some bolts I just printed tonight for the InMoov Robot.  What ya think?

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd396/whitestar011/20131107_195243.jpg

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6 Reply by techbuilder2175

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

definitely looks like banding

Powder coated steel enclosure, 1/4" Surface grounded hardened aluminum plate, MK2A Heat bed, .200 Polished fused quartz plate, Machined quick change hot bed mount, E3D hot end, Ramps 1.4, DRV8825 stepper motor drivers

7 Reply by WhiteStar01

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

Arrgh- This is worse than it has ever been and I'm tearing my hair out smile

So I tried bumping up the temp to 200- marginal improvement- 205 was too much.  Re measured filament average- 0.02mm smaller so changed Slic3r.  Added generate extra perimeters when needed and also upped the perimeters from 2 to 3.  The result is below.  Still seemingly totally random gapped layers.  I'm stumped.  Thoughts?

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd396/whitestar011/20131107_233137.jpg

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8 Reply by techbuilder2175

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

hows the layer adhesion?

Is it easy to break the layers?

Powder coated steel enclosure, 1/4" Surface grounded hardened aluminum plate, MK2A Heat bed, .200 Polished fused quartz plate, Machined quick change hot bed mount, E3D hot end, Ramps 1.4, DRV8825 stepper motor drivers

9 Reply by 2n2r5

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

techbuilder2175 wrote:

Print a rod
2n2r5 uses this to verify any banding

here's the post
http://www.soliforum.com/topic/3691/met … ew/page/3/

added below.

hows the layer adhesion?

Is it easy to break the layers?

+1 ...  tried with new filament?

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SD3 w/ mods:
Glass bed with QU-BD heat pad upgrade, threadless ballscrew w/ 8mm smooth rod, spectra line belt replacement, lawsy MK5 extruder, Lawsy replacement carriage, E3D hotend, Ramps 1.4 w/ reprap discount controller, DRV8825 drivers, 12v 30A PS, Acrylic case, Overkill Y-idlers, Filament alarm, Extruder fan + more.

2n2r5's Website

10 Reply by adrian

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

I'm sure you've checked it already, but I get this effect when I have mistakenly or deliberately set an incorrect value into filament width. Using 1.65mm filament with a 1.75mm setting causes Slic3r to think it can deliver more filament than it actually can. And it often can be because you're right on a threshold - having the filament width set to 1.7mm, 1.69 or 1.68mm will work just fine.. but as the filament slips down to say 1.66 or 1.65, it will be much less delivered than slic3r 'thinks' it will deliver...

The other place I get this effect is when my steps-per-mm on the extruder is wrong, because it has the same effect as outlined above.

Anyway - just food for thought....

11 Reply by WhiteStar01

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

The layer adhesion quite simply sucks.  In alot of the models lately I can break them easily at these troubled areas.  Hopefully I'll get a new roll of filament soon.  It is ordered.

I checked the filament width  and changed from 1.72 to 1.70 as the roll average seems to have narrowed.  little/no improvement. 

I guess I'll just have to wait for new filament- it's the only thing that makes sense to me right now since this printer was pretty much dialed in a very short time ago.  Any other thoughts- I'm all ears.

Thanks!

12 Reply by adrian (edited by adrian 2013-11-08 14:21:01)

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

layer adehsion is directly correlated to extrusion temp.

Try extruding at 200 or 205 (no more) and see if adhesion improves.

13 Reply by Claghorn

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

I found this poking around thingiverse: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:35088

I haven't tried testing it yet though, but it sounds good :-).

Claghorn's Website

14 Reply by WhiteStar01 (edited by WhiteStar01 2013-11-08 16:42:37)

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

Thanks everyone- trying a new print now (with a bunch of changes).  Seems like when it rains, it pours.  Last night it started shifting layers (on top of the other issues).  I had never tightened the belt for the extruder before and it was loose enough to skip (I think) Man what a beast to tighten that up.  Solidoodle could have done a bit nicer setup than that smile

Update soon with your suggestions implemented.  I did try 200 degrees last night- and it did help a bit- but didn't solve it outright.

Edit- here are the two prints that went sideways on me with layer shifts during testing- this might have actually been a good thing.

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15 Reply by WhiteStar01

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

My printer is back smile

So after all the fun, a few things were done and cumulatively- it seems to be all better now.  Did the following:
Remeasured filament width- went down by 0.02mm
Increased to 200 degrees on the extruder
Changed infill to 0.3
Changed perimeters from 2 to 3
Checked generate extra perimeters when needed
Tightened extruder belt - suspect this is what skipped during testing (had never adjusted this one before and it sucks)
Slightly tightened other belts- but nothing significant
Greased ALL rods and bushings- used SKF helicopter swash-plate grease (slick as goose pooh)
Right side lower rod bushing was not in contact with the rod- adjusted up

At the end of it all, I get the below results at 0.3mm with the cylinder supplied in this thread.  Methinks I should stop here smile

Thanks everyone!


http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd396/whitestar011/20131108_115258.jpg

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd396/whitestar011/20131108_115433.jpg

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16 Reply by muddtt

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

Wow looks great!

17 Reply by WhiteStar01

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Re: Uneven Layers/Gaps

Thanks to the folks here it's pretty good for all sock components a year old.  Just printing a big piece now and there is only one layer which had a small gap (currently about 2 inches tall) so not too shabby.  Probably the fact that its pretty old filament.  Also it might be my speed settings.  For whatever reason I have the external perimeters set to 30 (no % after) so maybe its too slow for large parts?  I'll have to do some digging in the forum to find some people's speed settings to compare.

It's been forever since I found the sweet spot for my speeds- but I'd bet they could be improved.

Cheers