1 (edited by pirvan 2013-12-30 06:41:54)

Topic: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

I've been having a fairy severe banding problem with my prints, and decided that it's time for an anti-backlash nut.

This evening I went to Lowe's looking for some 5/16" nuts so I can make my own AB nut.  While there I bought a variety of 5/16 nuts: standard, fine pitch, nylon locking and something called a "Well Nut".  A well nut is designed to act like a molly bolt, and to seal the hole around the screw shaft.  It's made of rubber, it has a flange at one end, and at the other it has an embedded nut (5/16" in this case).

Take a look at the picture below.  I simply threaded the nut from the top, until it bottomed out against the current leading nut holder.  The 4 bolts heads around the holder keep the Well nut body in place pretty snugly, while the rubber ( which is slightly compressed, pushes up against the screw tread.  The results is that all the play and backlash in the "Z" screw is gone.

http://www.soliforum.com/misc.php?action=pun_attachment&item=4222

Instant anti-backlash nut, without the need to disassemble or modify anything. 

Total installation time: 30 seconds
Total cost: $1.39

I printed a couple of test prints at .2mm and at .1mm.  Except for a band about 1.5mm from the bottom, the rest of the print is free of banding.

Compare the images below with the sample from one of my previous prints.  The detail of the girl's torso shows severe banding every 10 layers or so.  That print was done with .15mm layers

http://www.soliforum.com/misc.php?action=pun_attachment&item=4223


This weekend I'll try a more detailed print to see if the mod is still viable on more complicated prints

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To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

2

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

good catch... it's the same that a standard nut with a spring...
did it stay in place when you go up and down? ?

3

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

This looks like it, for anyone wanting a link:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_137185-37672-88 … Id=3012496

I personally hate going into a hardware store looking for one small specific thing. I much prefer to wander and see all the many wonderful things my wallet could obtain. So it's safer if I just order this online. smile

4

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Very nice, never even considered those type of nuts. My banding is getting worse so this is a cheap fix until I get an acme screw.

Just one point though. aren't they suppose to be used the other way up so the nut is further away from the material? This give more "adjustability" on the pressure but then you have to work around the flange binding on the nuts from the current nut holder.

5

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

sounds like my kind of fix....cheap smile

SD2 - Glass Bed, Fans on PCB and Y motor, Custom enclosure
Slicer - Simplify3D

6

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Well done Pirvan!

7

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

ysb wrote:

good catch... it's the same that a standard nut with a spring...
did it stay in place when you go up and down? ?

Same idea, except the rubber acts as the spring.  obviously the flange is not needed, as it doesn't need to hold a spring in place, so that can be trimmed if needed.

And yes, it stays in place perfectly.  I even put a silver paint index mark on the face of the rubber and the base to monitor the alignment, but it not moving at all.  I even moved the print bed a few times to its extents and it moves very nicely.

An added benefit was also it cut down the noise by quite a bit.  When you print, the "Z" movement noise is not really noticeable, but if you just move the bed up und down in large chunks, you can hear it distinctly, but not with this installed.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

8

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Charles_Xavier wrote:

This looks like it, for anyone wanting a link:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_137185-37672-88 … Id=3012496

I personally hate going into a hardware store looking for one small specific thing. I much prefer to wander and see all the many wonderful things my wallet could obtain. So it's safer if I just order this online. smile

Really, really...

...where's your sense of adventure, exploration... wink

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

9

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Zarni wrote:

Very nice, never even considered those type of nuts. My banding is getting worse so this is a cheap fix until I get an acme screw.

Just one point though. aren't they suppose to be used the other way up so the nut is further away from the material? This give more "adjustability" on the pressure but then you have to work around the flange binding on the nuts from the current nut holder.

You're right, if you install it upside down, you have more compressibility because the nut would be further away, and the're be more rubber in between.

However, this was a quick and dirty test to see if it would work, and there's still enough ribber that can be compressed.  It also allowed me to screw the nut down unitl it got wedged between the 4 bolt heads/nuts.  That's what's holding it in place right now.

If I were to put it in up side down, I'd need to secure it, probably with set screw through a hole in the flange.

I'm sure there's plenty of room for refinement.  So guys, please explore the possibilities, and post you findings here.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

10

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

wire10ga wrote:

sounds like my kind of fix....cheap smile

Just goes to show you that for every high-tech problem there's a low-tech fix. big_smile

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

11

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Briggs wrote:

Well done Pirvan!

Thannk you, thank you, THANK YOU !!!

(takes a bow)

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

12

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Nice work.. but.. it has to be said... You know, you can multi-quote in the one message wink

13 (edited by pirvan 2013-05-10 15:03:17)

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

adrian wrote:

Nice work.. but.. it has to be said... You know, you can multi-quote in the one message wink

I'm building my post count ....  wink

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

14

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Nicely done, Pirvan. Every little bit helps...keep my girlfriend from yelling at me because of the noise. big_smile

15 (edited by pirvan 2013-12-30 06:44:17)

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Just a quick follow up.  Has anyone else tried this little mod yet?   If yes, how is working for you, or is it?

Yesterday I re-printed one of my favorite models, Domino.  The first print was done with .15mm layers and had pretty visible banding.

This latest print is .1mm layers, and while there is still some minor banding, it's nowhere near as bad or visible as before. 

Here is a shot of the parts right after the print job had finished 

http://www.soliforum.com/misc.php?action=pun_attachment&item=4224

And the Before and After comparison

http://www.soliforum.com/misc.php?action=pun_attachment&item=4225

She's embarrassed to show her face without her hair.  wink

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To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

16

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

I rushed out and bought a well nut after seeing this.  One thing to be aware of is the amount of rubber overhang at the threaded end.  The first one I got, the threading was almost flush with the surface of the rubber, but a second one had a bit more overhang.  I'm tempted to notch out the flanged end and use it as the tensioning piece.  I only had time to do a single test print with it, and it was definitely better.

17

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

markm wrote:

I'm tempted to notch out the flanged end and use it as the tensioning piece.

Actually, that's a retty good idea.  Install it reverse than what I have, and use notches in the flage that line up with the existing retaining nuts.  That would require some work to get it down past the 4 retaining nuts though.

In my case, I have now used it to print a few things including the model above, and I think I put about 20 hours on it since I made the mod, and it hasn't moved 1mm yet.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

18

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

I went ahead and bought one of these and screwed it on and i have to say it helps alot, I have the aluminum Z platform and just screwed it on (upside down from your picture) and it seems to be staying alright, Ill work on fixing it later but for now it works! awesome idea.

19

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

great work!  Will this work with the aluminum carriage?

20

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

bertmcintosh wrote:

great work!  Will this work with the aluminum carriage?

see

zacgibson21 wrote:

I went ahead and bought one of these and screwed it on and i have to say it helps alot, I have the aluminum Z platform and just screwed it on (upside down from your picture) and it seems to be staying alright, Ill work on fixing it later but for now it works! awesome idea.

21

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

I'm thinking of picking one of these up and drilling/tapping M4 holes in the outer ring of the washer in the same configuration as the holes in the aluminum bed.  Tap those holes M4, then capture the well nut flange between the washer and bed.  Anybody that has the well nut in hand think that will work?

22

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

wilheldp wrote:

I'm thinking of picking one of these up and drilling/tapping M4 holes in the outer ring of the washer in the same configuration as the holes in the aluminum bed.  Tap those holes M4, then capture the well nut flange between the washer and bed.  Anybody that has the well nut in hand think that will work?

I think that slots will be more like it.  The diameter of the flange is too small for drilling a complete hole. 

However, from personal experience, friction has been holding mine in place now since I installed it.  It hasn't moved in about 60-70 print hours.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

23 (edited by jenkinsear1 2013-06-06 20:48:12)

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

For all the newbie's out there who might be tempted to Gorilla this down (like I did - doh) ... make sure you don't overtighten the well nut, or you may stop the rod from turning.  Put it on enough to be snug and it should stay in place.

And it does indeed work with the Aluminum carriage (SD3).

Thanks for the great tip!

24

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

Also are you guys aware that solidoodle z axis values are incorrect in the firmware? also you should go to the prusa calculator after correcting the firmware z value and find out what your printer custom layer height should be. doing these to things has made my prints so much more accurate.

25 (edited by adrian 2013-07-16 13:11:16)

Re: Poor Man's Anti-Backlash Nut - No Assembly Required

BRIGHAMVALDEZ wrote:

Also are you guys aware that solidoodle z axis values are incorrect in the firmware?.

What specifically ? We can fix it up in the community firmware - but I'm not aware of any issues beyond its stepping values are an approximation and not in anyway accurate to each specific printer.... Can you shed some light on what you mean ?

Lots of us have ditched the 5/16" anyway and moved to an M5 + Flexcoupler to solve other banding issues anyway so the values have been tweaked