1

Topic: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

After reading jefferysanders post about z-banding  I thought I'd share my solution.

I like jeffery's idea but I went in a different direction. I wanted to nail down as much of the problem in hardware before I explored any software/firmware solutions.

So, I'm returning to the issues I've had with banding. This is the banding I was getting:
0.2mm layer height cube

This banding is with the newer solidoodle method of having the motor shaft inside the threaded rod, and I was seeing worse issues with my original ABS solidoodle Z-axis rod.

I decided to get a new rod and went for an 8mm threaded rod with 1.25mm pitch. It was from a local hardware store and came in 1 meter length for about 5 bucks.

I updated the firmware via the 'Config...Firmware EEPROM Configuration' option in Repetier-Host to reflect the number of motor steps per mm for the metric rod (but you could do it old-school by editing the appropriate files during a firmware upgrade/reinstall).

Now to attach the new rod to the z-axis motor I tried a few options:

The first attempt was an aluminum beam coupling:
solid aluminum beam coupling

This was a problem to line up with the z-axis motor shaft and so I got banding again:
0.20mm layer height with solid aluminum beam coupling and misaligned 8mm threaded rod
So, I used a washer and 8mm nut above the coupling to force the alignment to improve - this was much better:
0.20mm layer height with solid aluminum beam coupling and 8mm threaded rod. 8mm nut and washer to assist alignment.

I was concerned that the alignment would not remain true so I explored an alternative - an aluminum helical beam coupling. This is not so susceptible to misalignment and so should remain true. It was good for banding but the flex in the coupling allowed some variation in layer height which left weak pieces when layers didn't meet well - you can see the gap about a 1/3 of the way up the piece:
0.20mm layer height with helical aluminum beam coupling and 8mm threaded rod

Figuring I was on the right track I changed the aluminum piece to a much stiffer stainless steel piece.
Stainless steel helical beam coupling
Stainless steel helical beam coupling

In addition, I used the nut and washer trick to get everything lined up as well as possible.
Stainless steel helical beam coupling with nut and washer
Stainless steel helical beam coupling with nut and washer

My first prints at 0.2mm were so good I killed the print and decided to go all-out crazy with 0.05mm layer height:
0.05mm layer height with stainless steel helical beam coupling

The entire brain slug is only 30mm in height.

Anyway, I hope the above helps people out and I'm happy to field any questions.

2

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

Wow. VERY nice approach! The community is strengthened by users like you. Thank you!

No trees were harmed in the creation of this email, though some electrons were horribly inconvenienced.

3

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

jenninaj, good stuff! would love to see some more prints as you continue to use this setup.

4

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

After reading your previous post about this, I started to look at getting the coupler shown and found that there's a version with rod clamping instead of set screws. Is there a reason you didn't go that route?

Although I admit that your nut and washer alignment solution is a lot cheaper than the price difference - that's a nice solution!

Don: Folger Tech 2020 Kossel Rev A + Borosilicate + Snow Effector
        Davinci 1.0 + Repetier : Filastruder
        SD3 + RAMPS + Lawsy Carriages + E3D + Borosilicate + ... : Cupcake

5 (edited by jenninaj 2013-03-31 13:36:32)

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

I didn't go that route because I didn't know about it - can you post a link? I don't know if the helical beam coupling is my final solution but its working extremely well at the moment.

I took down the previous post as it contained a commentary on imperial vs. metric rods and how they affect banding. I feared the outbreak of a religious war on the subject: message me privately if you want my thoughts on that subject.

6 (edited by jenninaj 2013-03-31 17:57:48)

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

Thanks for the support and thanks for your mod suggestions.

Here's the same print with a 1 cent coin:
0.05mm brain slug and 1 cent coin
0.05mm brain slug and 1 cent coin

7 (edited by Leghk 2013-03-31 19:23:08)

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

jenninaj wrote:

I didn't go that route because I didn't know about it - can you post a link? I don't know if the helical beam coupling is my final solution but its working extremely well at the moment.

I took down the previous post as it contained a commentary on imperial vs. metric rods and how they affect banding. I feared the outbreak of a religious war on the subject: message me privately if you want my thoughts on that subject.

The one I'd looked at is at http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0060M3QRQ, and I notice that it's just about 1/2 the max torque and 3mm larger diameter; I don't have my SD until Wednesday so I have no idea if the diameter's an issue. I'll have to poke around some more for higher torque on the clamping models, but clamp slippage may be the limiting factor there.

I hear you on the banding discussion, I'm keeping my own counsel on that issue as well.

Don: Folger Tech 2020 Kossel Rev A + Borosilicate + Snow Effector
        Davinci 1.0 + Repetier : Filastruder
        SD3 + RAMPS + Lawsy Carriages + E3D + Borosilicate + ... : Cupcake

8

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

Leghk wrote:
jenninaj wrote:

I didn't go that route because I didn't know about it - can you post a link? I don't know if the helical beam coupling is my final solution but its working extremely well at the moment.

I took down the previous post as it contained a commentary on imperial vs. metric rods and how they affect banding. I feared the outbreak of a religious war on the subject: message me privately if you want my thoughts on that subject.

The one I'd looked at is at http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0060M3QRQ, and I notice that it's just about 1/2 the max torque and 3mm larger diameter; I don't have my SD until Wednesday so I have no idea if the diameter's an issue. I'll have to poke around some more for higher torque on the clamping models, but clamp slippage may be the limiting factor there.

I hear you on the banding discussion, I'm keeping my own counsel on that issue as well.

I'd like to say that I considered the design you pointed me to and weighed up various pros and cons. However, in truth I just hadn't seen it. I don't know which method would be better and I suspect there will be little to choose between them.

9 (edited by jenninaj 2013-03-31 21:51:17)

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

I blew out a couple more prints with the new rig - at 0.10mm and 0.05mm. The object is the octopus from thingiverse scaled to 0.4.

0.10mm layer height octopus with 1 cent coin
0.05mm layer height octopus with 1 cent coin

10

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

jefferysanders wrote:

Great work man!  I also 100% agree that things should be as near to functionally perfect as possible from a mechanical perspective and I also feel the need to always strive for better and better results at lower layers heights myself as well (I can imagine nano capable printers and parts I can only assemble with special tools and a good microscope...OOO ya).  That .05 print looks really good, especially for a our .35 nozzle. (it's nice to have a cam and lens to be able to get good pics like that of  the .05mm lines) I would love to see it with something like a coin to give myself and other's a better frame of reference to the quality you have achieved.   Great results either way from a fairly inexpensive modification!!!

I currently shoot with an Olympus OM-D EM-5 and 12-50mm kit lens. The latter has a pretty good macro setting so it's easy to get these shots.

11

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

Your .05 mm prints are as good as I'll ever need to print.  Where did you source your coupling?  I checked McMaster and Amazon and neither looked like yours.

Thanks
B

12

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

Bad Coffee wrote:

Your .05 mm prints are as good as I'll ever need to print.  Where did you source your coupling?  I checked McMaster and Amazon and neither looked like yours.

Thanks
B

I got it from amazon. This is the link:
Ruland FSMR19-8-5-SS Set Screw Beam Coupling, Stainless Steel, Metric, 8mm Bore A Diameter, 5mm Bore B Diameter, 19.05mm OD, 31.75mm Length, 3.51 Nm Nominal Torque

Good luck and if you pick one up please let us all know if it worked for you too.

13

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

I have been using these ---> http://www.ebay.com/itm/330796927548?va … 1439.l2649 for some other stepper motor machines they work great, but I see these look the same as your link without the slot.--->http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi … 1194810480

14 (edited by DynamechGT 2013-04-06 17:36:07)

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

This post sold me.  I've been debating and researching which 3D printer I would get for a few weeks now (if at all).  I'll be ordering an SD3 tomorrow (sleep on it just to be sure).

Edit: purchased 6-Apr-2013

15

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

60$ for only a coupler.... it's a bit extreme...

16

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

ronsii wrote:

I have been using these ---> http://www.ebay.com/itm/330796927548?va … 1439.l2649 for some other stepper motor machines they work great, but I see these look the same as your link without the slot.--->http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi … 1194810480

I think the helical coupling is a good, robust, way to address the banding that many people see. My own - very limited - experiments suggest that aluminum is too soft/pliable/flexible in this type of coupling to lay down good quality layer heights. I certainly am not advocating the exact coupler I bought - there will be many other sources of helical coupling solution. My only guidance is to ensure that the coupling is relatively stiff for the layer height issue I saw. If those links are to stainless steel couplings then you have probably got yourself a bargain!

ysb wrote:

60$ for only a coupler.... it's a bit extreme...

I hear you but I have two thoughts:

  • The time spent on a good print is long, and the design stage before that usually even longer. If you consider that - and the satisfaction with the quality of your final piece - I consider this good value. As ronsii has noted, there are other couplings that will be cheaper and I'm sure will do at least as good a job. I'm just telling you what worked for me.


  • I am super lazy and amazon happened to have what I wanted. So I clicked the friendly orange button and waited for my new toy to arrive. Even on minimum wage, 8 hours of searching and driving around equals the price of one of these (pricey) couplings.

17

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

I was already planning on upgrading the z- asxis if necessary.  Like Jenninaj's last post, the couplers can be found for much cheaper than $60.  I'm happy that someone could demonstrate an easy fix that made a big difference.  I'm looking forward to spending more time prototyping than fixing my printer.  I know I'll have to put considerable time into the printer too but the less, the better.

18

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

Some more small prints this time printed at 0.20mm layer height and with acetone smoothing.

The piece is the evil ducky from thingiverse.

I put a one cent coin in the picture for scale against the ducks in the picture

19

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

Wow.  Nice and smooth.

Ordering coupling now.

I'm going to try it with the factory Z screw, and see if I need to change it to a lead screw later.

B

20

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

So how is the sd2s z rod attached from the factory? When I look at mine it looks like it is all one piece with the motor shaft? Do you have to cut the rod off the shaft to apply this fix?

21

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

the z threaded rod has a bore in the end which is pressed over the stepper shaft.

22

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

ronsii wrote:

the z threaded rod has a bore in the end which is pressed over the stepper shaft.

So if I understand this right. The long skinny z rod is put into a press and then is pressed into the z motor? Wouldn't that just beg to bend the rod?

23

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

It's a tight fit, but it slides on pretty easy, even with adhesive.

Getting it off is another story.  I used 3 jam nuts an screwed them down to the motor and the applied pressure to the nuts and it popped off after a couple turns.

24

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

Jonathan wrote:
ronsii wrote:

the z threaded rod has a bore in the end which is pressed over the stepper shaft.

So if I understand this right. The long skinny z rod is put into a press and then is pressed into the z motor? Wouldn't that just beg to bend the rod?

If you pressed it from the far end and it took more than say 200 lbs to seat it then yes...  but I would guess they thread a nut on the bored end and use an extension to press it on which would eliminate the probably of bending. From the 'bent z' issues I have seen I am thinking the bore was not aligned and sometimes not centered in the rod causing problems.

25 (edited by iowajames 2013-04-17 02:50:30)

Re: Z-Banding reduction using helical beam coupling

ronsii wrote:
Jonathan wrote:
ronsii wrote:

the z threaded rod has a bore in the end which is pressed over the stepper shaft.

So if I understand this right. The long skinny z rod is put into a press and then is pressed into the z motor? Wouldn't that just beg to bend the rod?

If you pressed it from the far end and it took more than say 200 lbs to seat it then yes...  but I would guess they thread a nut on the bored end and use an extension to press it on which would eliminate the probably of bending. From the 'bent z' issues I have seen I am thinking the bore was not aligned and sometimes not centered in the rod causing problems.

I got my old one off using a metal tube just big enough to fit over the rod, then a nut to turn it down until it forced the motor shaft to come free (thanks fellow doodlers for the tip) & then I put my motor on my flat counter & gently tapped my new rod on with a soft faced 3 lb dead blow hammer (knocking it squarely, mind you) and my banding is virtually nonexistent now. Either I didn't bend the rod, or I knocked the bend out of my new rod as I put it on. tongue
The piece I used, actually, was a male-male brass extension for shop air hoses, the kind you buy from Harbor Freight, it fit the rod & did the job. Now I have it set aside for just that. XD

No trees were harmed in the creation of this email, though some electrons were horribly inconvenienced.