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Topic: Please help with Extruder and Bed

So I have read many threads about the extruder and none of them seemed to help me.  I've been reading great forum since September and though I was prepared for when my Press arrived but I cant even get it through the zoffset.

When it comes to drawing the lines the extruder seems to jam and twitches back and forth....BUT, I can extrude 100mm of filament no problem when x and y has been homed.  The problem ONLY persists when the hotend is near the bed and it is trying to print and or do the z offset.

I have checked the cables going into the motor which seem fine (plus I can extrude using the software perfectly well), I have checked the grub screw which is tight and as I mentioned it does extrude when told to do so, but not when asked to print.

The other problem I am having is getting the filament (that does come out) to stick to the bed, it just seems to peel right off or bunch up around the hot end.  Please could you let me know what initial offset should be used when running the calibration?

I am using soliprint 1.1.1, my hotend is 250 and bed 90

I have tried to run the offset several times and I cannot set because nothing sticks to the bed and the extruder doesn't always extrude.

I expected a battle but didnt expect to get stuck at the first hurdle, please help sad

Many Thanks

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Are you putting glue stick or hairspray on your bed to help the plastic stick?

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Fredjikrang wrote:

Are you putting glue stick or hairspray on your bed to help the plastic stick?

I am using TRESemme extra strength hairspray with no luck, it doesn't even seem to be attempting to stick.  I should mention that this is my first printer also.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Robny wrote:
Fredjikrang wrote:

Are you putting glue stick or hairspray on your bed to help the plastic stick?

I am using TRESemme extra strength hairspray with no luck, it doesn't even seem to be attempting to stick.  I should mention that this is my first printer also.

Aquanet extra super hold will work much better than tresemme or glue stick wink

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Robny wrote:

  Please could you let me know what initial offset should be used when running the calibration?
Many Thanks

Try 3.3 to 3.6. (Not sure how much variance there is beween machines.) I you are too close to the bed, the filament squirts sideways as it comes out, preventing it from adhering. Also the limited clearance tends to stall the extruder.

The old fashioned way of setting z offset is to measure the thickness of something, command the nozzle to that height, are see if the object barely fits. The calibration routine will set is a bit lower than that to get a little extra squish.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

trayracing wrote:
Robny wrote:

  Please could you let me know what initial offset should be used when running the calibration?
Many Thanks

Try 3.3 to 3.6. (Not sure how much variance there is beween machines.) I you are too close to the bed, the filament squirts sideways as it comes out, preventing it from adhering. Also the limited clearance tends to stall the extruder.

The old fashioned way of setting z offset is to measure the thickness of something, command the nozzle to that height, are see if the object barely fits. The calibration routine will set is a bit lower than that to get a little extra squish.


Thanks, I will try that - it was default at 5 and that never worked then I pushed it up in small increments to around 6.something, which also did nothing.  I never actually tried the decreasing the value, will give it another shot.

jagowilson wrote:

Aquanet extra super hold will work much better than tresemme or glue stick wink

Will give that shot also.

Thanks for the advice

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

I am getting this same problem during the first few layers. It extrudes smoothly except for the first few layers. I'm still trying to get the z offset right.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

My Z offset is right around 4.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Fredjikrang wrote:

My Z offset is right around 4.

Awesome thanks

That seems to be the way to go then, I have obviously been trying to adjust the wring way, will give it a shot.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

You have to LOWER the z-offset value to INCREASE the spacing between the platform and the nozzle.  I made the same mistake initially.  When it defaulted to 5 and you bumped it up to 6 you were actually telling it to jam the nozzle into the bed even harder.  smile

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Mysterio wrote:

You have to LOWER the z-offset value to INCREASE the spacing between the platform and the nozzle.  I made the same mistake initially.  When it defaulted to 5 and you bumped it up to 6 you were actually telling it to jam the nozzle into the bed even harder.  smile


Thanks. I've been trying to figure out what coordinates the off used.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

I've gone down to as low as 4.10 and still it does not stick to the bed and bunches up around the nozzle, maybe I should try glue stick instead, or the hair spray recommended above as no offset seems to make a difference.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

+1 on Hairspray as mentioned!  If your plastic is not sticking at all, gap is irrelevant...get it to stick and then dial in the 1st layer gap.

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

IronMan wrote:

+1 on Hairspray as mentioned!  If your plastic is not sticking at all, gap is irrelevant...get it to stick and then dial in the 1st layer gap.

Yep even free air extrusion should stick pretty good to the plate.

15 (edited by Mysterio 2015-02-24 19:11:33)

Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

IronMan wrote:

+1 on Hairspray as mentioned!  If your plastic is not sticking at all, gap is irrelevant...get it to stick and then dial in the 1st layer gap.

Gap may be irrelevant but the complete absence of a gap is not irrelevant...  when I had my z-offset screwed up the ABS curled up as it was extruding in the exact same way.  It's actually scraping against the glass in constant contact, gouging it's way through any hairspray coating or purple glue stick you may have used.  Additionally, back-pressure will build up and you'll eventually get a clog you need to clear.

1.  Reduce the Z offset til you get something reasonable, or heck just set it to 0 so it's trying to print up in the air.  But having it force the nozzle into the glass then drag itself across it while it attempts to print isn't doing you any favors.

2.  Apply your hairspray or glue stick or whatever.

3.  Fine-tune your Z-offset.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Mysterio wrote:

Gap may be irrelevant but the complete absence of a gap is not irrelevant...

Very true...you definitely should have a gap...as I said you just need to get it dialed in after your plastic is sticking.

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

What can I do if it is not sticking at all, my bed is set at the default 90 degrees in soliprint 1.1.1 and I am using hairspray.

So long as I have a gap between nozzle and bed it should stick?, I can extrude 100mm with no problems with x and y homed but even when that eventually makes contact with the bed it doesn't stick?

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Try 110c Or as high as your bed can make it. I use 105. You may just have to print on it a bit first to get it broken in, in my experience... Using aquanet now ?

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

jagowilson wrote:

Try 110c Or as high as your bed can make it. I use 105. You may just have to print on it a bit first to get it broken in, in my experience... Using aquanet now ?

I tried up to 95 but I am convinced now that it is the hairspray I am using because it doesn't feel tacky or sticky what so ever, I cant get out to get any different hairspray as yet because I work at sea, I need to wait until we hit port next, which will be the 26th.  So I will get some aquanet and also get a glue stick and try both, I'm pretty sure that is the problem.  If either of these dont work then I have no idea what to do.

BTW....Once I adjusted my offset significantly to lower the bed height my extruda never skipped/jammed so I think becuase the filament was just piling up at the bottom of the nozzle it was creating a bit of a blockage.  Hopefully the glue or aquanet will resolve this also.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

Try aquanet before glue stick. Glue stick works but aquanet works better.

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

jagowilson wrote:

Try aquanet...

Was that a nautical pun? Robny's at sea. smile (And here I was going to suggest Kapton...)

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

trayracing wrote:
jagowilson wrote:

Try aquanet...

Was that a nautical pun? Robny's at sea. smile (And here I was going to suggest Kapton...)


BuBum Chshhhh!

Hahaha - LOL smile

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

@Robny

So you are at sea and you have a printer...this is totally cool...please elaborate!!

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

No kidding!!

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Re: Please help with Extruder and Bed

IronMan wrote:

@Robny

So you are at sea and you have a printer...this is totally cool...please elaborate!!

Not as cool as you might imagine smile

I work on cruise ships and our regular home port is in Florida, so I'm able to get things delivered to the ship with a fair amount of reliability.  However, the difficulty comes when you need to buy this, or buy that or try this as you may have to wait a few days before you get to a port or even longer if you have to wait for a port big enough to find decent hardware stores.