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SoliForum - 3D Printing Community → 3D Printer Discussion → anything to absorb the strong ABS smell from my printer?
It's not toxic and it's not stinky, but the odor is kind of "strong", like ecig glycerinvapor or excessive fog machine fog in a club, if you know what I mean. is there anything that I can use, like put inside the printer case to decrease the odor, by say absorbing the gases?
I know some Solidoodle 4s have some kind of filter on the fan which blows air out of the printer but mine didn't.
A lot of people with Makerbots build this.
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:125264
It's not toxic and it's not stinky, but the odor is kind of "strong", like ecig glycerinvapor or excessive fog machine fog in a club, if you know what I mean. is there anything that I can use, like put inside the printer case to decrease the odor, by say absorbing the gases?
I know some Solidoodle 4s have some kind of filter on the fan which blows air out of the printer but mine didn't.
WRONG!
sounds like you need to read the MSDS doc
http://www.soliforum.com/topic/3298/3d- … te-inside/
I know for fact a long ABS print over an hour in a modern built home as air tight as they are, do cause harmful health effects. a few symptoms of health effects besides smells and maybe setting off smoke detectors. are Eye throat irritation, including blood shot capillaries in eyes (long term exposure can make some damage permanent), headaches, nausea, coughing, poor thought processing. pets, children and elderly or people with poor health already are even effected worse. and other materials have much worse hazards. but most Hobbyists already know hazards of the materials they work with daily and take proper measures to prevent any safety issues.
activated charcoal filtration air-purifiers help with most ABS/PLA fumes. but even NASA had to find other materials with lowest 'off gassing' google it.
its not as benign as 'fog' (oil smoke), or Pot etc. some materials are more in the category of "black lung" disease like Coal miners can get, or worse. as not all long term effects are known yet. maybe in 30 years you will see Law firm infomercials for "3D printers disease" "if you have ever owned or operated a 3D printer and have been diagnosed with _________ call our toll free hotline now!" ;^)
I have a smoke absorber for my filastruder... It is basically just a fan and a charcoal/activated carbon filter. Weller makes them, you can get them for about $70. It works well for the extruder, but it would be rather large for a 3D printer. The carbon filter removes the fumes and much of the smell of polycarbonate, which smells worse than ABS.
Alternatively to purchasing one, you could put together a fan assembly yourself and add in a carbon filter, which is basically what dubbsd posted. It looks like the one he mentioned uses static to attract the contaminates? Both would work I suppose.
sounds like you need to read the MSDS doc
Which msds doc?
The ones I've read only say, like this ( http://www.plasticsmadesimple.com/DataS … SDS_GP.pdf ) one, that "processing fumes may cause irritation to the eyes, skin and respiratory tract, and in cases of severe overexposure, nausea and headache". None has happened to me.
As for the research linked, I wouldn't be surprised, but the results aren't conclusive to to call them facts. As for NASA, of course even non-toxic gases are not something you'd want in a space station.
But okay, I can take what I said back and call the fumes toxic if you wish.
As for the answers, thanks guys.
I know for fact a long ABS print over an hour in a modern built home as air tight as they are, do cause harmful health effects. a few symptoms of health effects besides smells and maybe setting off smoke detectors. are Eye throat irritation, including blood shot capillaries in eyes (long term exposure can make some damage permanent), headaches, nausea, coughing, poor thought processing. pets, children and elderly or people with poor health already are even effected worse. and other materials have much worse hazards. but most Hobbyists already know hazards of the materials they work with daily and take proper measures to prevent any safety issues.
activated charcoal filtration air-purifiers help with most ABS/PLA fumes. but even NASA had to find other materials with lowest 'off gassing' google it.
its not as benign as 'fog' (oil smoke), or Pot etc. some materials are more in the category of "black lung" disease like Coal miners can get, or worse. as not all long term effects are known yet. maybe in 30 years you will see Law firm infomercials for "3D printers disease" "if you have ever owned or operated a 3D printer and have been diagnosed with _________ call our toll free hotline now!" ;^)
It'd help if you cited studies on your 'facts'.
I've never detected any smells frankly, but I do have a ceiling mounted 4" exhaust fan that I run to vent my enclosed printer work area which is about 8' x 10'
n2ri wrote:sounds like you need to read the MSDS doc
Which msds doc?
The ones I've read only say, like this ( http://www.plasticsmadesimple.com/DataS … SDS_GP.pdf ) one, that "processing fumes may cause irritation to the eyes, skin and respiratory tract, and in cases of severe overexposure, nausea and headache". None has happened to me.
As for the research linked, I wouldn't be surprised, but the results aren't conclusive to to call them facts. As for NASA, of course even non-toxic gases are not something you'd want in a space station.
But okay, I can take what I said back and call the fumes toxic if you wish.As for the answers, thanks guys.
there is an MSDS for every product out. search for e.g. "ABS MSDS pdf"
n2ri wrote:I know for fact a long ABS print over an hour in a modern built home as air tight as they are, do cause harmful health effects. a few symptoms of health effects besides smells and maybe setting off smoke detectors. are Eye throat irritation, including blood shot capillaries in eyes (long term exposure can make some damage permanent), headaches, nausea, coughing, poor thought processing. pets, children and elderly or people with poor health already are even effected worse. and other materials have much worse hazards. but most Hobbyists already know hazards of the materials they work with daily and take proper measures to prevent any safety issues.
activated charcoal filtration air-purifiers help with most ABS/PLA fumes. but even NASA had to find other materials with lowest 'off gassing' google it.
its not as benign as 'fog' (oil smoke), or Pot etc. some materials are more in the category of "black lung" disease like Coal miners can get, or worse. as not all long term effects are known yet. maybe in 30 years you will see Law firm infomercials for "3D printers disease" "if you have ever owned or operated a 3D printer and have been diagnosed with _________ call our toll free hotline now!" ;^)
It'd help if you cited studies on your 'facts'.
some of the symptoms are listed in MSDS but I am talking of just what my own family and friends have had right here in my home. and what Dr. told them.
here is just 1 but not a lot on "off gassing" when melted or any testing done with 3D printing yet. as i stated above
http://www.unicgroup.com/upfiles/file11170761914.pdf
still gives plenty to substantiate what I have found 1st hand
maybe only non smokers can smell the fumes? I have no smokers in my family or home so... I think smoking is also hazardous to your health?? seems I read that some place.
also this was in the thingaverse link above
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar … 1013005086
there is an MSDS for every product out. search for e.g. "ABS MSDS pdf"
I just linked to one myself. MSDS is not something universal, every company has its own.
You replied to my previous comment where I said ABS fume not being "toxic" with "WRONG!".
The MSDS you linked to also just mentions that ABS "may cause irritation".
I don't understand how you can compare it to cigarette smoke, doesn't thermal decomposition happen there and harmful carcinogenic chemicals are created?
if anything, at this point abs fume would be as much of a toxic as alcohol, not cigarette smoke.
I'll admit that I don't know much about ultrafine particles, only that we still don't know much about their health effects, but I don't think you've provided any proof for claiming the opposite either.
A little more on topic: I guess the fan blowing the air out of the box is the best place for putting a filter?
n2ri wrote:there is an MSDS for every product out. search for e.g. "ABS MSDS pdf"
I just linked to one myself. MSDS is not something universal, every company has its own.
You replied to my previous comment where I said ABS fume not being "toxic" with "WRONG!".
The MSDS you linked to also just mentions that ABS "may cause irritation".
I don't understand how you can compare it to cigarette smoke, doesn't thermal decomposition happen there and harmful carcinogenic chemicals are created?
if anything, at this point abs fume would be as much of a toxic as alcohol, not cigarette smoke.
I'll admit that I don't know much about ultrafine particles, only that we still don't know much about their health effects, but I don't think you've provided any proof for claiming the opposite either.A little more on topic: I guess the fan blowing the air out of the box is the best place for putting a filter?
"alcohol"? thats way toxic. lol thousands die each year from alcohol poisoning. we are talking about 'off gassing' from melting plastics etc. thats lots more unknown health effects than alcohol, Tobacco or oil smoke which all are known to be bad for health.
and companies/manufacturers dont just make up their own MSDS documents. they have to use 3rd party labs and regulated standards by places like NFPA, UL, safety codes etc. heck whats the use of them if a corporation could just say "oh its safe trust me"? I have spent most my 40 year career following these type safety laws and maintaining compliance with such codes. they are not just to hamper your desires to do whatever you want. they are to save lives and property destruction.
you sound like people that say "oh those traffic signals dont apply to me riding a bike, they are just for licensed vehicles. then they cruise right through a stop sign and wonder why they got ran over by cross traffic that didnt even have a stop sign. just use a little common sense and you may live longer.
I stated above what ill effects people in my home had as a result of 3D printing ABS fumes caused on prints of only an hour or so. and my home is not near as air tight as most. since it was built in 1960. and I only have 1 Solidoodle 2 printer. it took 3 days of no printing and air out home, for the blood red streaks to clear up in my eyes after just a couple days printing 1-2 items a day. I dont call that just irritation. so I got an air purifier also posted above. plus when weather allows I open a window nearby. I also intend to install a powered dryer vent exhaust to outside soon and connect it to inclosure of printer like I have on my air brush paint booth. like I stated above, NASA even took it serious for the space station 3D printer. also need to read that entire MSDS doc and you will see much more known and unknown hazards. plus its only referring to ABS in raw form. the other link is a lab study on what happens when heated and melted. they list more effects and again state there is more to be learned with additional studies. so like I stated already, since 3D printing in homes and offices is in its infancy still, regulations are still to come I am sure that will surprise you. and there are many other materials used in all types of 3D printing methods some of which already have known hazards much worse.
yeah I still print and prefer results using ABS. but being safe about it is not an option.
n2ri, reread my post.
I've already replied to your nasa space station point.
The point I said there isn't just one MSDS was because the ones I read didn't say anything other than "may cause irritation". The one you linked doesn't either. Technically mild irritant, which a lot of things are, is maybe "toxic", but you cannot compare it to narcotics or even carcinogenics just because they all belong to a larger group.
And I also said that we don't know enough about the effects to say it is either safe or unsafe. So I never said it is safe just because there's no proof it isn't.
Again, reread my post.
I'm sorry for what happened to your family, but that is just anecdotal evidence. You have no way to know it wasn't caused from something else happening during that time. For example, allergic reaction.
I have yet to see any such record anywhere else.
And comparing me to someone who gets ran over by traffic is just obnoxious...
From what I have read ABS is a mixture of toxic chemicals. And 10 times more toxic than pla.
So what do we do? Since this is mostly a hobby forum and the people here print for fun the choice of action is up to the individual. My former allergy asthma specialist told me dilution is the solution to pollution.
so what are the choices.
1) passive ventilation . Place the printer in a spare room garage ect open a couple of widows.
Advantages it is easy. disadvantages lets humidity in in summer time cold air in in winter..
2) filtration a fan directed through a charcoal filter that draws the fumes from the printer and keeps them out of the living/work space. Advantages you can place the printer anywhere in the room. Disadvantages the cost of filters.
3) direct exhaust to the outside. duct the fumes to the outside world. disadvantages limited location for printer must be near a window . advantages no filter cost and more flexible location of printer.
How dangerous are the fumes . As said earlier the jury is out on this time will tell. But I do not think there is one answer.
In a well sealed well insulated house fumes are more likely to build up. A old house with infiltration exfiltration the fumes will dissipate . I expect some brands of filament will gas more than others. Personal heath and history. People who have had previous chemical exposier and exposer to sensitizers such as isocyanates may have more issues. It seems the very young and the old are more sensitive to exposiers as well.
The amount of printing done and more than one printer being used another factor.
So be safe protect yourself and family.
More info here.
http://www.leafygreenplanet.com/3d-printing-fumes/
Tin
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