1 Topic by rlemmermann

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Topic: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Hi there - I'm going to try to give all the details. We have been getting wobbling in the print layers that is progressively getting worse. After putting the glass plate on, it is far more pronounced. I did play a bit with the z-axis. I did follow the video to align it back.

What led us to see this, is a random splitting between layers on a print. It's never in the same place though. I have uploaded pictures for that too. I did go into irc, but the recommendations that were presented are already the defaults--so I didn't want to play with them

The brim is no longer attaching to the print either. This was odd. But even as I'm printing, the brim is not attached anymore

One last thing is that the extruder took two full rotations before it printed. It wasn't clogged because we had to clean the dribble before we printed.

We are using ABS at 215 extruder and 105 heated bed

Thank you in advance for your help!

Rich

2 Reply by wire10ga

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

What machine to do you have?  Is the build area enclosed?

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3 Reply by rlemmermann

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Good morning!  We have the Solidoodle Gen 4.   The unit is enclosed  Thank you for your help!  Rich

4 Reply by IronMan

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Possibly under extruding...also may want to bump the extrusion temp up a few degrees.  Not familiar with the SD4; what hot end do you have?

Have you done all of the standard calibrations?

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5 Reply by rlemmermann

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Hey IronMan -

We had everything working well until i put the glass plate on. When I did, i thought i had to tweak the z-axis. So, i kept turning it, but nothing happened. After looking at what it does, i see that i affected it.  I thought that i fixed the z-axis by watching the video.  Would that cause these issues do you think?

6 Reply by IronMan

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

rlemmermann wrote:

Hey IronMan -

We had everything working well until i put the glass plate on. When I did, i thought i had to tweak the z-axis. So, i kept turning it, but nothing happened. After looking at what it does, i see that i affected it.  I thought that i fixed the z-axis by watching the video.  Would that cause these issues do you think?

Since you were at least printing before the glass plate, then let's start there...

If your extruding before the print (you had to clean the nozzle drips); then could it be that your nozzle is too close to or touching the glass?  This could prevent extrusion...

You say you adjusted the Z-axis to compensate for the glass plate; did you re-level the bed using a dollar bill or similar thickness?  This would give you the correct starting gap to the glass plate.  Also, the leveling should be done while everything is up to heat.  Careful not to burn yourself!

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
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7 Reply by rlemmermann

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

I did recalibrate--but it was cold when i did it. I'll try when hot.  Also, is it possible that with another brand ABS, that we have to adjust flow control to avoid splitting? Sorry for dumb questions...I'm learning this as we go

Cheers, Rich

8 Reply by IronMan

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

rlemmermann wrote:

I did recalibrate--but it was cold when i did it. I'll try when hot.  Also, is it possible that with another brand ABS, that we have to adjust flow control to avoid splitting? Sorry for dumb questions...I'm learning this as we go

Cheers, Rich

If you changed brands(or spools), then a difference in diameter could contribute to your issue.  As a rule when changing filaments:

Open Slic3r Configuration
Measure the new filament diameter - enter that value into Slic3r under "Filament Settings"
Set Extrusion Multiplier to 1
Set Infill to 0%
Set Solid Layers to 2
Uncheck "generate extra perimeters when needed"
Run a small single perimeter calibration cube eg. 1" x 1" x 1/2" high
Kill the print before the top of the cube finishes (maybe at the last 4 layers)
Check the wall thickness

If the thickness measures .48mm you're in luck!  But it probably won't...
Let's say for example you get .53mm.  Then you want to make the following adjustment to your Extrusion Multiplier:
Since .53 is about 10% higher than .48; you will want to extrude at about 10% less, therefore, enter 0.9 as your Extrusion Multiplier.

Rerun the cube to check and all should be good.  BTW, if you plan on switching out filaments and keeping partial spools, then you can mark the Ext Multiplier and diameter settings on the spool so you can enter those next time upon switching.

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9 Reply by rlemmermann

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Wow sir. Thank you so much for the details. I will let you know how it works out when i get home today    Cheers sir, Rich

10 Reply by rlemmermann (edited by rlemmermann 2014-10-06 16:38:08)

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Will that help with the banding/ribbing and wobbling too? Also the reason for the brim not connecting to it?  Thank you, Rich

11 Reply by IronMan (edited by IronMan 2014-10-06 17:01:55)

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

rlemmermann wrote:

Will that help with the banding/ribbing and wobbling too? Also the reason for the brim not connecting to it?  Thank you, Rich

It's a good idea to get your flow calibrated first, then you can go from there.  Banding can be caused by Z-axis wobble or even print bed heat variation.  Save that for later...

BTW, I forgot to mention this, but the following step should be done before any of the steps I outlined above:

http://solidoodletips.wordpress.com/201 … libration/

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12 Reply by rlemmermann

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Awesome sir...thank you.  Once we do that, how do we solve the banding? Is there a doc out there we can follow too? Thank you again for all of your guidance! Rich

13 Reply by reidbaker

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

What you should make sure to look at is the filament settings.

I HIGHLY recommend actually getting a proper measurement on the filament you're using (I use a digital caliper). Most are 1.75mm as listed, but I've seen them measured anywhere from 1.7mm to 1.86mm (including stuff FROM Solidoodle). Make sure you set that since it makes a huge difference.

You'll also want to check your feed rate to make sure it's consistent with what's actually being pulled by the machine and then check your extrusion multiplier since you may be pulling more than what it should be. I have mine set at .92 and it seems to do a fantastic job on my prints (it originally was pulling slightly too much and was blobbing).

Do you suspect any issue with the belts? I had to tighten one of my Y axis belts since it was jittery, but created a rather consistent shake on one direction (as the belt moved towards the glass it jittered, but when moved away it was fine - had to adjust the left Y belt (via tightening the hex screw on the assembly that has the y belt housed near the left side of the front door) since it was slightly out of alignment and it's now perfect.

Just some thoughts. You should post pictures so we can see.

14 Reply by rlemmermann

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Hi there - first, I would like to thank you guys again for your continued help!!  We did the changes above and the print came out much better. It still had a small separation, but that may because I changed the infill to 0 (that piece was hollow). We are going to change it back to .4 and see what happens.

Is there a doc to describe the different fill patterns?

Thank you,

Cheers,

Rich

15 Reply by rlemmermann

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Hi guys - So, this particular print takes 3 hours, so I have a couple of examples of the issues. We did do the procedure for the nozzle calibration. Even with it though, we still see some issues

Here are a few pictures to show the z-banding (I believe that is what we call the rough lines?) Not entirely sure what I'm missing. Thank you all again so much

http://lemmermann.us/3d/crackbyrightmiddlehindge.JPG
http://lemmermann.us/3d/majorBanding-2.JPG
http://lemmermann.us/3d/majorBanding.JPG
http://lemmermann.us/3d/majorZBanding.JPG
http://lemmermann.us/3d/MoreZBanding.JPG
http://lemmermann.us/3d/sporadiccracking.JPG
http://lemmermann.us/3d/startingtoZband.JPG

16 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

Those prints actually look really good, aside from the cracks. There's no z-banding. I'm guessing what you're referring to is layers, and those are present in any FDM print.

Cracks can be solved by heating the enclosure and/or increasing hotend temperature.

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17 Reply by rlemmermann

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

hi there - when I did the 5cm^3 test, the sides came out fine and were smooth. It seems that the higher it gets the more unlevel it is.

this picture should actually be flat at the top, but it has a bowing to it
http://lemmermann.us/3d/majorBanding.JPG

18 Reply by elmoret

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Re: Wobbling, splittling, brim not attaching

That's warp, not banding. Happens due to thermal expansion coeff of ABS. You can combat it by heating the build chamber or using PLA which has a lower TEc.

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