1 Topic by gwfami

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Topic: Still can't print with ABS

When I first tried ABS, I was able to print out a small own.  After that, I haven't been able to get the ABS to feed consistently.  I've tried temperature variations, changes on the filament tensioner, clean the print feeder a number of times and tried 2 different types of ABS, neither of which will feed.

Weird thing is if I put the head to the home position, and press the extrude button, it extrudes fine.  Did this a number of times feeding 100 mm of line at a time.

Thinking that perhaps the peek was absorbing too much heat and slipping, I mounted a 40mm fan so that the peek is cooled.  That didn't work, it still doesn't feed, just sets there stripping the filament.

No problem with PLA though.

I really need to get this to work with ABS.

Help.....

2 Reply by muddtt

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

is your roll tangled up causing bad feed? maybe your PLA role isn't tangled.

3 Reply by gwfami

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Nope, babying the roll myself to make sure there isn't a roll related problem.

4 Reply by gwfami

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

After 15 or so hours of trying to print the ABS, I'm giving up.  Don't know if it's a bad batch of filament or what, but nothing I have tried works.

Tried the following
extrusion temperature from 180 -215
bed temperature from room to 105
mounting fan for peek
hand feeding it a little at a time
cleaning the whole machine from ABS dust that is constantly generated.

Nothing!

The sad part is I know others have gotten it to work well.

At the end of my rope with ABS....

5 Reply by techbuilder2175

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Did you purchase the abs from solidoodle?

I have found more problems from their filament then any benefits.

What's your distance from the nozzle to the bed?

Do you have the z axis down while extruding?

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6 Reply by michael.t.albers

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

How is your bed equipped?  Have you sprayed it with aquanet or something similiar (abs slurry is another good one).  Sounds like you are not getting the abs to stick to the platform.  Also check your platform calibration.

7 Reply by Hazer

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

gwfami wrote:

I haven't been able to get the ABS to feed consistently.

This is not enough to go by. Are you getting curling? Are you getting delamination? Are the threads too thin? Pictures?

Without explaining what the problem is in more detail, your problem could be anywhere from a clogged nozzle to bad slicer settings.

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8 Reply by gwfami (edited by gwfami 2013-10-27 15:25:32)

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Did you purchase the abs from solidoodle?

   No.  Purchased from KBell Engineering.

What's your distance from the nozzle to the bed?
 
   .152 mm

Do you have the z axis down while extruding?

    Only when dumping filament out.

How is your bed equipped? 
 
    Heated bed, topped with kapton tabe and coated with aquanet.  Also tried with ceramic tile coated with aquanet, same result.

Also check your platform calibration.
 
    Bed has been leveled and get consistent prints with PLA.

Are you getting curling?

   No.

Are you getting delamination?  Are the threads too thin?

  Unknown, can't get enough to extrude to check for delamination.  Threads coming out seem appropriate, but blobby.

Pictures?

  Will try to get some.


.... clogged nozzle

  No indication of nozzle being clogged, again, prints fine with PLA.

... bad slicer settings.

  Use same slicer settings, except printer changed from pla to abs, so slicer settings probably not the cause.

9 Reply by IanJohnson

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

There is probably something wrong in the PEEK.  If it won't work with cooling, I would write it off.  I've had to replace them a few times myself.  The PTFE inside can get deformed, or if the PEEK gets too hot once, the threads might melt a little and allow a gap to open inside.  Between the PTFE liner and the top of the brass barrel.  Soft or melted filament gets pushed sideways into the gap creating more drag and difficult extrusion. 

At this point you should probably replace the hot end, though I would recommend getting a J-Head or E3D rather than one from Solidoodle.

10 Reply by gwfami (edited by gwfami 2013-10-27 17:07:32)

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Why would it work great with PLA if the peek is the issue?

Here are some photo's.

Photo of the head shows what it looks like after trying to print (I pushed the filament down so you could see the noms).

The other photo shows that it attempts to print, but doesn't even complete the first circle.

Also attached is a short video showing the head extruding prior to printing.  Please note that both the bearing and the toothed drive are turning (black marks on them) and the filament is coming out nicely.

The second video shows the beginning of the print as well as the filament just getting ground away then switches to show the toothed drive and the bearing.  You have to look close for the black marks on each, but you can see the toothed drive happily turning away, while the bearing just sits all grumpy like not turning.

Please excuse the poor videography, as it was taken with a cell phone.

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11 Reply by Claghorn

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Totally random theory: It does need more power to print ABS at higher temps than PLA (if I'm remembering correctly). Maybe something in the electronics or motors is overheating after trying to print for a while? I'm afraid I have no idea how to test that though (maybe point a fan at the back of the printer to cool the electronics and see if it gets farther?).

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12 Reply by gwfami

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

The print that I did (pics and videos above) were done at 195 C for the print head and 95 C for the bed.  I have ran PLA at that temperature without any issues.

Good random theory, but if it works with PLA, then I doubt there is a motor/electronics overheating issue.

Claghorn wrote:

Totally random theory: It does need more power to print ABS at higher temps than PLA (if I'm remembering correctly). Maybe something in the electronics or motors is overheating after trying to print for a while? I'm afraid I have no idea how to test that though (maybe point a fan at the back of the printer to cool the electronics and see if it gets farther?).

13 Reply by Hazer

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

You should be printing PLA at 165, not 195. Are your temperatures getting changed by slicer after you manually heat them? Do you know that you have to set your temperatures in slicer in the filament tab, or else they get over-written for the first and second layer? Its a long shot, but check what your temperature is during the print.

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14 Reply by gwfami

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

I generally run about 187 with the PLA.  I've slicer sometimes does make a change, but I change em back.

15 Reply by gwfami

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Success!

Mounted the ABS above the printer, that way gravity helps the feed.  Runs 100% better, but still creates a lot of ABS dust when running.

16 Reply by muddtt

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

gwfami wrote:

Success!

Mounted the ABS above the printer, that way gravity helps the feed.  Runs 100% better, but still creates a lot of ABS dust when running.

Dust?

17 Reply by gwfami

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

even when the feeder is working, it apparently "shaves" some off that accumulates in the bearing and in the teeth of the feeder mechanism.  Messing with the tension doesn't seem to improve it.

18 Reply by Hazer

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Can you measure the diameter of the filament you are using?

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19 Reply by gwfami

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Actually, the feed quit 1/2 way through a 1 1/2 hour print.  Print also has poor cohesion like it didn't get melted together and has a really blobby surface.

Here's a couple of pictures showing the ABS dust that accumulated during the run.

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20 Reply by muddtt

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Seems like you just have a really bad roll of ABS.

21 Reply by NormanTan

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

Could it be too tight a tension? can cause high pressure on the filament and micro cracks and shedding of abs.

I have abs filament from Solidoodle site, the filament did not bend the way as shown in the picture.
Calibrate is a must.

Cheers. my 2 cent worth.

gwfami wrote:

Actually, the feed quit 1/2 way through a 1 1/2 hour print.  Print also has poor cohesion like it didn't get melted together and has a really blobby surface.

Here's a couple of pictures showing the ABS dust that accumulated during the run.

22 Reply by sgmorton

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

I am having the same problem with KBell ABS.  The exact same problems. Feeds then stops and grinds for no reason. Feeds fine in space. Sometimes I can get it print decent then it blows up. Swap it for Monoprice ABS or Sainsmart ABS and it works perfectly with beautiful results.  I have tried 3 different colors of KBell all with the same issues. IF you solve it please let me know! I've got a roll of clear, orange and pink I want to use!

23 Reply by gwfami

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Re: Still can't print with ABS

My ABS is from KBell also.  I wonder if they have a problem with their supplier.  Their PLA is great, but can't use their ABS.