1

Topic: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

We've all had our share of frustration with getting/keeping our FDM printers running. Does anyone here have first hand experience or good hearsay about the reliability of the Form 2?

It seems like it would be less likely to foul up, but I don't know.

I sure get tired of fighting my SD3. Some of my parts take 7 or 8 hours to print and a crash is significant. I can't run a business on this machine.

Robox printer, HICTOP (Prusa i3 variant) Model 3DP17 printer, ELEK 2.5W laser engraver, AutoDesk 123D Design, Windows 10

2

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

Amen brother! but I dont think any tech as complicated as a 3D printer can be called anything close to 'trouble free' any more than a 3 year old kid ;^P I was looking at the ibox NANO resin type tiny version of form labs also in cost. but seems lots of new worms in those cans and couldnt even get help converting STL files to its file type then inventor seems to have gone AWOL. so the printers are not the only 'flaky' items in 3D printing tech nowadays, so I decided to stick with my SD2 and this forum for its support til things settle down.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

3

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

both resin and powder SLA printers have as much or more cons as FDM besides cost plus not near the comunity support due to that cost making them out of reach for most of us still

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

4 (edited by carl_m1968 2016-01-16 23:59:37)

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

You should try a CTC dual head printer.. Mine has run 12 24 hour prints with no issues what so ever.. But it has been modded quite a bit. Make sure it is the all metal and CT'c and not CTC.. Many are selling under the name CTC and those are junk. The real deal is made by CT'c but I would advise dumping the Mightyboard controller right off and adding a more open source controller.

The biggest issue with a Resin based SLA is curing.. The laser only hardens those areas that it actually makes contact with. So unless you print at 100% infill on every print you will have voids that will be filled with liquid Resin. You have to buy or build and additional UV curing oven where you can but the object in and flood it with UV for sever more hours to cure it through out. Also to mu knowledge all of the SLA Resin is translucent or even transparent. I have yet to see an item printed on an SLA Resin based system that was opaque. If that's not an issue then they still have the same movement components that can still have the same issue as an FDM machine as far as the movement goes. There are some based on scanning mirrors but those have even more issues with alignment and other things in the optical path.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

5

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

ultra fine detail is my desire for my micro scale prints and less support cleanup. but a duel extruder FDM with disolvable support in one head is lowest cost/easiest option ATM. so I may find an SD3 cheap and mod it into a better version of an Apprentice. then get an SLA when a good low cost one is available for my tiny prints. til then I am working on an Atlas 3D scanner to convert my old school items I was making with other manufacturing ways b4 the 3D printer came. that way I will be ready for the next big thing. I have over 10k STL files and may never make most of them only what customers request.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

6 (edited by pirvan 2016-01-17 00:59:05)

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

carl_m1968 wrote:

Also to mu knowledge all of the SLA Resin is translucent or even transparent. I have yet to see an item printed on an SLA Resin based system that was opaque.

SLA resins are available in opaque colors.  A company called MakerJuice, sells resins for most of the common SLA printers on the market, and they come in a variety of colors, and what's really cool, is you can mix different colors to achieve more colors and shades.

If you want a printer with fewer moving part, then you should opt for DLP/SLA printer.  It has no moving print head or laser, or mirrors (unless you count the millions of little mirrors that make up the DLP chip).  It simply projects an image for each layer, and the light cures the resin.  There are still some moving parts, like all SLA/resin printers, it has to have the tilting mechanism that separates the print from the build surface, but that's all.

carl_m1968 wrote:

The biggest issue with a Resin based SLA is curing.. The laser only hardens those areas that it actually makes contact with. So unless you print at 100% infill on every print you will have voids that will be filled with liquid Resin.

Incorrect, the SLA printers print the object upside down, while lifting it out of the resin tub, so as each layer is then separated from the build surface (bottom of the tub), the remaining resin simply runs out.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

7

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

pirvan wrote:
carl_m1968 wrote:

Also to mu knowledge all of the SLA Resin is translucent or even transparent. I have yet to see an item printed on an SLA Resin based system that was opaque.

SLA resins are available in opaque colors.  A company called MakerJuice, sells resins for most of the common SLA printers on the market, and they come in a variety of colors, and what's really cool, is you can mix different colors to achieve more colors and shades.

If you want a printer with fewer moving part, then you should opt for DLP/SLA printer.  It has no moving print head or laser, or mirrors (unless you count the millions of little mirrors that make up the DLP chip).  It simply projects an image for each layer, and the light cures the resin.  There are still some moving parts, like all SLA/resin printers, it has to have the tilting mechanism that separates the print from the build surface, but that's all.

carl_m1968 wrote:

The biggest issue with a Resin based SLA is curing.. The laser only hardens those areas that it actually makes contact with. So unless you print at 100% infill on every print you will have voids that will be filled with liquid Resin.


Depends on the printer design.. The Peachy prints from the bottom up and there are a few other that lower the print into the resin as it prints.
Incorrect, the SLA printers print the object upside down, while lifting it out of the resin tub, so as each layer is then separated from the build surface (bottom of the tub), the remaining resin simply runs out.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

8 (edited by pirvan 2016-01-17 03:18:24)

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

carl_m1968 wrote:

Depends on the printer design.. The Peachy prints from the bottom up and there are a few other that lower the print into the resin as it prints.

The Peachy is about as far a departure from a proper SLA printer as one can get, so you can't compare how the Peachy functions to a SLA printer.

Proper SLA printers print by projecting a laser or UV light at the bottom of a vat that contains resin, then through a tilting process the cured layer is separated from the vat and lifted up to make room for the next layer.  That's how MOST SLA printers work, and in the context of the original question (referencing FormLabs), that is how the FormLabs work.

Therefore your assessment that:

The biggest issue with a Resin based SLA is curing.. The laser only hardens those areas that it actually makes contact with. So unless you print at 100% infill on every print you will have voids that will be filled with liquid Resin. You have to buy or build and additional UV curing oven where you can but the object in and flood it with UV for sever more hours to cure it through out.

... is off base.

Comparing the Peachy to a FormLabs is like comparing a bicycle to an automobile.  Yes, both will get you from point "A" to point "B", but that's where the comparison stops.

Edit:

So far as I can tell, the Peachy basically takes advantage of the fact the resin floats on top of water, so they use a drip system that can be measured and controlled to fill the container with water to lift the level of the build "surface".  Ingenious idea, even if it's somewhat limited.  The layer thickness can vary, and the surface can have slight ripples enough to make the surface quality suffer dramatically. 

All you need to do is take a loo at the sample, and you can see the quality is pretty mediocre at best.

Neat toy, and I can see the appeal of buying and playing around with a $100 toy, but that about it.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

9 (edited by carl_m1968 2016-01-17 03:26:33)

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

pirvan wrote:
carl_m1968 wrote:

Depends on the printer design.. The Peachy prints from the bottom up and there are a few other that lower the print into the resin as it prints.

The Peachy is about as far a departure from a proper SLA printer as one can get, so you can't compare how the Peachy functions to a SLA printer.

Proper SLA printers print by projecting a laser or UV light at the bottom of a vat that contains resin, then through a tilting process the cured layer is separated from the vat and lifted up to make room for the next layer.  That's how MOST SLA printers work, and in the context of the original question (referencing FormLabs), that is how the FormLabs work.

Therefore your assessment that:

The biggest issue with a Resin based SLA is curing.. The laser only hardens those areas that it actually makes contact with. So unless you print at 100% infill on every print you will have voids that will be filled with liquid Resin. You have to buy or build and additional UV curing oven where you can but the object in and flood it with UV for sever more hours to cure it through out.

... is off base.

Comparing the Peachy to a FormLabs is like comparing a bicycle to an automobile.  Yes, both will get you from point "A" to point "B", but that's where the comparison stops.

Edit:

So far as I can tell, the Peachy basically takes advantage of the fact the resin floats on top of water, so they use a drip system that can be measured and controlled to fill the container with water to lift the level of the build "surface".  Ingenious idea, even if it's somewhat limited.  The layer thickness can vary, and the surface can have slight ripples enough to make the surface quality suffer dramatically. 

All you need to do is take a loo at the sample, and you can see the quality is pretty mediocre at best.

Neat toy, and I can see the appeal of buying and playing around with a $100 toy, but that about it.


You must be looking at the old info.. They have made some changes and it now even includes a scanner for the same $100 price tag. That alone is worth the $100 even if the prints are not so good. The samples I saw on the indigogo site looked very close to injection mold quality and had very little noticeable layers. As for the ripple the drip system is designed so the drip does not actually go into the tank but into the feed tube that will still raise the water level but not make the water move on it's surface. That is below the waters surface. So you raise the level in the feed tube and the level in the tank will rise to match it.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

10

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

I wasn't referring to ripples from the drip systems, rather than ripples from vibrations around the room.  AS for the quality, all one needs to do is go to their web site and check out the gallery.

http://www.peachyprinter.com/#!gallery/c1q6m

I for one am not impressed.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

11 (edited by carl_m1968 2016-01-17 04:39:29)

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

pirvan wrote:

I wasn't referring to ripples from the drip systems, rather than ripples from vibrations around the room.  AS for the quality, all one needs to do is go to their web site and check out the gallery.

http://www.peachyprinter.com/#!gallery/c1q6m

I for one am not impressed.


That website has not been updated in 2 years. They no longer even use it. Everything about it is now on this sites where it was backed at.

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/the- … r#/updates

Like I said $100 for a scanner is not a bad deal... So even if the printer does not do a good job you still get a scanner..

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

12

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

I have no idea what it is you're looking at, but the Peachy printer page is up to date and in sync with the Indiegogo page.  The only thing that is different is the Indiegogo page updates are numbered, whereas the updates on the website are in the form of a blog.

I've seen all their images and their latest videos and if this is the best it can do, I'm not interested.

http://d2oadd98wnjs7n.cloudfront.net/file_attachments/63326/files/20130909120504-dave.JPG?1378753504
https://static.wixstatic.com/media/40b86d_75afb5542ae04416b53de4fe82df9f2c.jpg/v1/fit/w_400,h_481,q_90,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/40b86d_75afb5542ae04416b53de4fe82df9f2c.jpg

Unless of course, you're looking at a totally different gallery than I am...

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

13

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

pirvan wrote:

I have no idea what it is you're looking at, but the Peachy printer page is up to date and in sync with the Indiegogo page.  The only thing that is different is the Indiegogo page updates are numbered, whereas the updates on the website are in the form of a blog.

I've seen all their images and their latest videos and if this is the best it can do, I'm not interested.

http://d2oadd98wnjs7n.cloudfront.net/file_attachments/63326/files/20130909120504-dave.JPG?1378753504
https://static.wixstatic.com/media/40b86d_75afb5542ae04416b53de4fe82df9f2c.jpg/v1/fit/w_400,h_481,q_90,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/40b86d_75afb5542ae04416b53de4fe82df9f2c.jpg

Unless of course, you're looking at a totally different gallery than I am...

So you don't think $100 is a good deal for scanner?

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

14 (edited by pirvan 2016-01-17 07:13:29)

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

I thought we were discussing SLA printers, not scanners.

But since you brought it up, I haven't seen the quality of the scanner output, so I can't say whether it's a good deal or not.

Anyway, this is getting way off topic, so let's drop it.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

15

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

powder SLA printers build from bottom up by sifting/spreading thin layers of powdered material then melting together only the area to print. then there are the glue type that can even have color ink for full color prints and these are the highest cost and post print cleanup is intense in lab conditions with an air blast chamber etc.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

16

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

Aren't powder based designs all SLS? I thought SLA was liquid resin, either Laser or DLP.

And, again, I think it's a damn shame Solidator is in purgatory. Surely there is a VC firm out there that would back those guys. The DEO is a Microsoft Mktg exec and the design looks great, well considered.

Robox printer, HICTOP (Prusa i3 variant) Model 3DP17 printer, ELEK 2.5W laser engraver, AutoDesk 123D Design, Windows 10

17 (edited by pirvan 2016-01-17 18:43:17)

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

Heartlander wrote:

Aren't powder based designs all SLS? I thought SLA was liquid resin, either Laser or DLP.

And, again, I think it's a damn shame Solidator is in purgatory. Surely there is a VC firm out there that would back those guys. The DEO is a Microsoft Mktg exec and the design looks great, well considered.

You are correct.  It would appear that some folks are confused about the different technologies.

SLA:
Stereolithography is an additive manufacturing process that works by focusing an ultraviolet (UV) laser on to a vat of photopolymer resin.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereolithography

SLS:
An additive manufacturing layer technology, SLS involves the use of a high power laser (for example, a carbon dioxide laser) to fuse small particles of plastic, metal, ceramic, or glass powders into a mass that has a desired three-dimensional shape.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_laser_sintering

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.

18

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

the new Blue printer is a powder type that uses different light than standard Laser. also some use other heat source and some even use glue and color inks for the powders. there are many variations of each type 3D printer tech now and growing. one even uses solar light in desert sand. search it on youtube. Arabs use it already

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

19 (edited by n2ri 2016-01-18 09:13:15)

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

also a liquid type 3D printer that makes perfect DNA objects not Resin either nor UV

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

20

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

not too many years ago only 1 type 3D printing was done now there are many variations of more than 6 base types and expanding rapidly. so confused? yeah whos not LOL

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

21

Re: How trouble-free is the FormLabs 2?

The discussion was about SLA printers (Resin), not SLS (powder).  You referenced "powder SLA printers", which is the wrong terminology, so we brought it.  If you're clear on the different technologies and the proper nomenclature, then good for you.

To print or, 3D print, that is the question...
SD3 printer w/too many mods,  Printrbot Simple Maker Ed.,  FormLabs Form 1+
AnyCubic Photon, Shining 3D EinScan-S & Atlas 3D scanners...
...and too much time on my hands.