26

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

Try this:

https://solidoodletips.wordpress.com/20 … libration/

Then this:

https://solidoodletips.wordpress.com/20 … flow-rate/

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

27

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

oh wait Im thinking cm

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

28

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

100 mm's = 10 cm's
100 cm's = 1 meter
So 100 mm's = about 3.94 inches.

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

29 (edited by n2ri 2015-08-06 21:30:16)

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?


thanks Ironman when I reviewed the 2nd link I saw an issue I had with the Slic3r setting I was doing test prints with. had wrong layer/fill settings etc. also saw a comment on there how to fill in the 'gaps' I am battling. will try these items 1st b4 making big changes since it printed so good for couple years other than the gap thing.

still dont get why your supposed to use 1mm layer but 3 layers setting as it says?

yep! was using wrong test slicer settings. 1.75mm at 1 multiplier comes out at .42mm walls. dont know when that got changed to .7 multiplier. now to reset infil on my slicer setting for items being printed with gaps.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

30

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

n2ri wrote:

thanks Ironman when I reviewed the 2nd link I saw an issue I had with the Slic3r setting I was doing test prints with. had wrong layer/fill settings etc. also saw a comment on there how to fill in the 'gaps' I am battling. will try these items 1st b4 making big changes since it printed so good for couple years other than the gap thing.

still dont get why your supposed to use 1mm layer but 3 layers setting as it says?



What are you talking about 1mm layer but 3 layers?

They use a setting of 1 for the perimeters but that is not mm that is an actual number so vertical walls are only 1 layer wide.

You use 1 for this calibration step but in actual prints that would be changed to the same as your top and bottom layer which is usually 2 or 3.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

31

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

what I mean is, I was using 1mm layers and had infill set at 1 and was getting much wider single walls than when I changed it to 3 layers high and zero infill settings.

thats what makes no since to me. taller layers make thinner width walls?

so they must not stick together as well either since they dont press down as much (which is what made them wider b4)

but also saw posts of people increasing infill as much as 1.2 to prevent gaps in walls/perimeters when using multiples like 2 or more or on top/bottom solid layers. which is the only issue I was having originaly

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

32 (edited by carl_m1968 2015-08-07 00:20:24)

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

n2ri wrote:

what I mean is, I was using 1mm layers and had infill set at 1 and was getting much wider single walls than when I changed it to 3 layers high and zero infill settings.

thats what makes no since to me. taller layers make thinner width walls?

so they must not stick together as well either since they dont press down as much (which is what made them wider b4)

but also saw posts of people increasing infill as much as 1.2 to prevent gaps in walls/perimeters when using multiples like 2 or more or on top/bottom solid layers. which is the only issue I was having originaly


1mm layers are some pretty freaking thick layers. Are you sure you don't mean .1mm? You really need to work on your metric conversions so your questions are easier to understand.

I am still confused as going by the pictures in that link the "infill every" option they have set at 1 is irrelevant since infill % is set to ZERO. However if  there was a percentage selected then that option would make an infill layer on every layer. If set to 2 it would skip a layer. Not real sure how or why you would want to skip layers on infill though.

Infill has no affect on wall width. Infill is simply just what it says. it is the passes that are made to fill the voids inside of our models.

Layer height also has no bearing on wall width either except for the first layer. That layer width is dictated by the .15mm gap you have between the bed and nozzle. If your machine is calibrated right  then and an extrusion multiplier of 1.00 and an extrusion width of .42 should give you walls that are .42mm wide. If not then your calibration is still off but you can tweak it with the multiplier.

I think you are over thinking settings and their meanings and making it confusing yourself. The settings are very literal in what they do and if you hover your mouse over one there is even a pop up that comes up explaining it's function in more detail. You also need to beaware what section the settings is under.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

33 (edited by n2ri 2015-08-07 02:06:01)

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

carl_m1968 wrote:
n2ri wrote:

what I mean is, I was using 1mm layers and had infill set at 1 and was getting much wider single walls than when I changed it to 3 layers high and zero infill settings.

thats what makes no since to me. taller layers make thinner width walls?

so they must not stick together as well either since they dont press down as much (which is what made them wider b4)

but also saw posts of people increasing infill as much as 1.2 to prevent gaps in walls/perimeters when using multiples like 2 or more or on top/bottom solid layers. which is the only issue I was having originaly


1mm layers are some pretty freaking thick layers. Are you sure you don't mean .1mm? You really need to work on your metric conversions so your questions are easier to understand.

I am still confused as going by the pictures in that link the "infill every" option they have set at 1 is irrelevant since infill % is set to ZERO. However if  there was a percentage selected then that option would make an infill layer on every layer. If set to 2 it would skip a layer. Not real sure how or why you would want to skip layers on infill though.

Infill has no affect on wall width. Infill is simply just what it says. it is the passes that are made to fill the voids inside of our models.

Layer height also has no bearing on wall width either except for the first layer. That layer width is dictated by the .15mm gap you have between the bed and nozzle. If your machine is calibrated right  then and an extrusion multiplier of 1.00 and an extrusion width of .42 should give you walls that are .42mm wide. If not then your calibration is still off but you can tweak it with the multiplier.

I think you are over thinking settings and their meanings and making it confusing yourself. The settings are very literal in what they do and if you hover your mouse over one there is even a pop up that comes up explaining it's function in more detail. You also need to beaware what section the settings is under.

yes forgot the decimal on infill. also the guy that commented setting it at 1.2 that wont work. but infill of .5 does help and if you do that same test Slic3r setting and make layers 1 instead of 3 as it says. wall is gonna be thicker always due to compression each layer being greater than when set at 3. thats why I couldnt get down to .42mm until raising layers to 3 as it says. and my gaps are also gone when making infil .5 as the other guy commented. .6 causes a bit of ooze due to slight over extrusion. oh and I am printing with an Slic3r profile using 2mm layers in my model that had gaps b4.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

34

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

Missed a decimal there. It's 0.1 meters or 10 centimeters.

SD2 Expert stock, ABS fume fan,
XYZ DaVinci 1.0 stock ABS, Simplify3D
QUBD Two-Up PLA, new 3D printed X gantry, Y idler, flex z coupler, extruder mount, E3D Lite

35

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?


This link says .42 is ideal for .3mm layer height. If we are keeping with 1.4:1 ratio does that mean the ideal for .1mm printing is .14?

36 (edited by IronMan 2015-08-17 15:48:36)

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

Extrusion width has more to do with Nozzle diameter than layer height.

0.3 layer height is a good standard to calibrate with.  The extrusion width should be set as a factor of x1.2 of the nozzle; so for a 0.35 dia. nozzle, the extrusion width settings should be 0.42...a 0.4 dia nozzle would have a setting of 0.48...

After calibration for the flow rate is completed, then changing the layer heights in Slic3r generally will compensate to keep the extrusion width close to what you need.

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

37

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

IronMan wrote:

Extrusion width has more to do with Nozzle diameter than layer height.

0.3 layer height is a good standard to calibrate with.  The extrusion width should be set as a factor of x1.2 of the nozzle; so for a 0.35 dia. nozzle, the extrusion width settings should be 0.42...a 0.4 dis nozzle would have a setting of 0.48...

After calibration for the flow rate is completed, then changing the layer heights in Slic3r generally will compensate to keep the extrusion width close to what you need.

Perhaps you can help me out. Is this a flow rate problem?

http://soliforum.com/i/?gYcQ6Is.jpg

I was printing the nickel calibration disk that I found on thingiverse. I have already calibrated my extruder to pull 100mm give or take .5mm. I also bought a feeler gauge and leveled my bed to the nozzle with a distance of .1mm from bed to nozzle.
The layer height and first layer height were set to .1mm. I was going to calibrate the flowrate after I confirmed my x and y steps per mm were accurate.

38

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

It looks to me like you're trying to print the first layer too thin (even for 0.1mm!) - I'd highly recommend setting your first layer to 0.2mm for the moment, get that dialed in, and then attempt 0.1mm (it's quite tricky to get right out of the blue).

When levelling the bed, the feeler gauge is great - but to get the first layer height right, the only way I've succeeded is to then print a skirt / single wall on the bed, peel it off, and measure with calipers - adjusting the z-stop to bring the whole (level) bed up and down until it's right. And for adhesion, I often aim for my first layer to be a bit under theoretical height too (e.g. 0.20-0.22mm for 0.25mm first layer).

Note that Z=0 is theoretically nozzle-touching-bed (zero gap), the printer will move to Z=first_layer_height to print the first layer...

So you've done the 100mm extruder calibration? I'd follow this up next with:
* Measure actual filament diameter, enter this into slic3r filament settings
* Print a single-wall calibration cube, and use the slic3r extrusion multiplier (filament settings again) to achieve the correct wall thickness (as IronMan described).

Then you can proceed to ensuring that first layer is correct! smile

SD3. Mk2b + glass, heated enclosure, GT2 belts, direct drive y shaft, linear bearings, bowden-feed E3D v5 w/ 0.9° stepper
Smoothieboard via Octoprint on RPi

39 (edited by n2ri 2015-08-17 06:32:42)

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

ultra thin 1 layer prints are near impossible to get even with a glass bed and not very usable either.

also what type caliper are you using and to measure what? extruded plastic or a depth gauge mounted to extruder?

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

40

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

n2ri wrote:

ultra thin 1 layer prints are near impossible to get even with a glass bed and not very usable either

+1
Figure most people will want to use the third dimension of their 3d printer a bit though, so never really thought of it as an issue hehe.
Get an l-cheapo laser module and cut paper instead haha!

Still, you should be able to achieve a consistent first layer thickness at 0.2mm.

Just thinking again Dingo - if that photo is the aluminium bed with kapton, you may find trying out a sheet of glass with hairspray straight on top will be better for very thin layers. Let's see how the 0.2mm goes first though.

SD3. Mk2b + glass, heated enclosure, GT2 belts, direct drive y shaft, linear bearings, bowden-feed E3D v5 w/ 0.9° stepper
Smoothieboard via Octoprint on RPi

41

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

grob wrote:

It looks to me like you're trying to print the first layer too thin (even for 0.1mm!) - I'd highly recommend setting your first layer to 0.2mm for the moment, get that dialed in, and then attempt 0.1mm (it's quite tricky to get right out of the blue).

When levelling the bed, the feeler gauge is great - but to get the first layer height right, the only way I've succeeded is to then print a skirt / single wall on the bed, peel it off, and measure with calipers - adjusting the z-stop to bring the whole (level) bed up and down until it's right. And for adhesion, I often aim for my first layer to be a bit under theoretical height too (e.g. 0.20-0.22mm for 0.25mm first layer).

Note that Z=0 is theoretically nozzle-touching-bed (zero gap), the printer will move to Z=first_layer_height to print the first layer...

So you've done the 100mm extruder calibration? I'd follow this up next with:
* Measure actual filament diameter, enter this into slic3r filament settings
* Print a single-wall calibration cube, and use the slic3r extrusion multiplier (filament settings again) to achieve the correct wall thickness (as IronMan described).

Then you can proceed to ensuring that first layer is correct! smile

I've completed my calibrations:
I did the 100mm pull, I took 5 readings and input the average as my filament diameter, I re-calibrated my nozzle to bed distance with the next step up on my feeler  gauges at .13mm, and I printed my single wall cube.

All of the calibrations are now perfect except for the cube. According to my readings I'm over extruding by 83% but my surface layers had some holes in them and my walls were really thin so I upped the extrusion multiplier instead. Its currently set to 1.03. I think this might be due to a combination of cheap $5 dollar harbor freight calipers and improperly stored filament. I had it sitting out in the open for a year before I found out that was a really bad way of storing it. I'm in the process of making a container with silica for it.

After all of this work Ive come to what I think is a relatively good 95% calibration, and I'm printing far more accurately than I ever have before. I was able to get 0.1mm first layer height without messing up every time so far, granted I've only done 4 prints since.

I'm not sure what use a single layer print would have but I agree its not going to be very strong its a little bit thinner than paper and much weaker against tears.

My bed is currently set up to be a glass plate on top of my original aluminum bed with the kapton still on. Its held on with binder clips which are a horrible pain in the ass and I'm currently working on a clip less adapter for securing the glass. I'm currently using a light mist of Thermasilk heat activated hairspray, but when you mentioned it I realized Im going to run out soon and I discovered they no longer make it. I have to search for a replacement since the heat activation was excellent for the heated bed.

42

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

Sounds like you're in control, good work! Congratulations on that 0.1mm first layer, the glass is probably key. smile

Still curious about the cube though - so when you say "I'm overextruding by 83%", do you mean you printed a single-wall cube, measured the wall thickness and instead of being the targeted 0.48mm it was (1.83 * 0.48 smile 0.88mm? That's a bit wild, and doesn't seem to be corroborated by your observations of holes in the print or improved results with an increased multiplier... I think the settings you have settled on are likely good, but there's just something funny in the cal cube print settings / calculations there!

Re replacement hairspray, look for "extra hold" or similar on the front of the can, and then on the back amongst the ingredients:
* Vinyl Acetate/Crotonates Acid/Vinyl Neodecanoate Copolymer (sometimes VA=Vinyl Acetate, sometimes "Acid" missing)
* Acrylates Copolymer

SD3. Mk2b + glass, heated enclosure, GT2 belts, direct drive y shaft, linear bearings, bowden-feed E3D v5 w/ 0.9° stepper
Smoothieboard via Octoprint on RPi

43

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

grob wrote:

Sounds like you're in control, good work! Congratulations on that 0.1mm first layer, the glass is probably key. smile

Still curious about the cube though - so when you say "I'm overextruding by 83%", do you mean you printed a single-wall cube, measured the wall thickness and instead of being the targeted 0.48mm it was (1.83 * 0.48 smile 0.88mm? That's a bit wild, and doesn't seem to be corroborated by your observations of holes in the print or improved results with an increased multiplier... I think the settings you have settled on are likely good, but there's just something funny in the cal cube print settings / calculations there!

Re replacement hairspray, look for "extra hold" or similar on the front of the can, and then on the back amongst the ingredients:
* Vinyl Acetate/Crotonates Acid/Vinyl Neodecanoate Copolymer (sometimes VA=Vinyl Acetate, sometimes "Acid" missing)
* Acrylates Copolymer

I did 2 things:
First I printed a cube at 0.1mm layer height and told it that the extruded line width had to be 0.35. When it was over I measured the wall I got a reading of .42

Second I printed a cube at 0.3mm layer height and told it to give me a 0.42 width. I measured it and got 0.48.

I made a test print of a little dragon fish figure and there were gaps in my lines instead of _____ it was more like ____ ____ every now and then. thats why I supsect humidity in my filament.

Ive adjusted the flow to 1.03 and have been printing the lawsy mk5 Jig replacement because I cracked my acrylic when I was taking it apart. So far I dont notice any major problems.
-
http://soliforum.com/i/?iiztRVb.jpg

44

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

.48 is actually correct for a .3 layer height.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

45

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

use plenty infil on the Lawsy parts too

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

46

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

n2ri wrote:

use plenty infil on the Lawsy parts too

I used 20% and they feel pretty solid, though I think I could snap them if I used all my finger strength to bend them. Should I have used 100%?

47

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

Yes 100%

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

48

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

DingoThe3rd wrote:
n2ri wrote:

use plenty infil on the Lawsy parts too

I used 20% and they feel pretty solid, though I think I could snap them if I used all my finger strength to bend them. Should I have used 100%?

For anything functional that will be used to do work or support anything, you should use 80% infill minimum.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

49 (edited by jagowilson 2015-08-18 23:47:31)

Re: RH manual Control flow settings for SD2?

Not sure if anyone mentioned it yet but those parts do not need support, looks like you have them enabled.