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Topic: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

After unboxing and setting up, I attempted to print the miniature version of the solidoodle as a test. I do have a heated bed, set the extruder to 200 and bed to 100, warmed up, and went.

It went well for about the first 20 layers, and while I was trying to monitor everything to make sure it was working fine, I did miss that the extruder was no longer pulling filament (stripped it...).

I removed the tension nut, spring and washers on the right side of the extruder, and using the hole already available and the having the arm all the way undone, brushed and cleaned all the ABS dust off, and blew it out, removed a small piece from below where the extruder could grab, and then close it back up.

Issue now is that the flow isn't the same, when printing the plastic appears to be coming out too slow, and as such isn't sticking anymore. I tried adjusting the tension on the spring to less, and wouldn't pull at all, and if adjusted too high the extruder motor would 'jump' when the teeth grooves it made hopped. Almost as if it was pushing the plastic in, but couldn't move it through. If not printing, and just randomly extruding, a 2-3 second wait and it will extrude fine, seeming as if the plastic isn't melting fast enough. Considering the first print stuck, and was working until the filament jacked up, I'm wondering what the heck has changed to make it not work...

Help?

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

First thing to check is if the filament is still going straight below the gear.  If it is bending and bulging under the gear, then it is getting too hot up there.  Is the fan on the motor running?

Do you have a small case fan you can plug in, or other small fan?  Try blowing some air for awhile on the top of the hot end, but try to shield the nozzle from the airflow so it can stay hot.  Aim for the area above the black insulting wrap that covers the nozzle.  Do this for a couple of minutes and then try extruding 50mm or so of filament and see if it still skips. 

The first bit always goes through, because some plastic has oozed out, and you are seeing it start skipping after the barrel has filled back up.  See if the fan helps it keep extruding without skipping.  If it does help, take off the fan and see if it is still working a few minutes later.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

Fan is running, but no 'deflector' cover that other people had was on it, so I was assuming it was phased out of the design.

One thing I did notice from the unbox, there was some ABS in the teeth of extruder that pulls the filament down. I tried using a scribe to get all of it out but some of it almost seems like it was compressed on there.

In your experience is having more or less tension on the extruder spring better?

Thanks for the prompt reply, I've been following on the groups and on here and it's amazing they don't cut you a pay check.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

Tried doing that, no luck. Still barely extruding any plastic and seems like it is having a hard time pushing the filament through.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

I think I've got the extruder issue fixed. Now it only jumps occasionally but seems to be extruding consistently.

However I am still having the issue of no sticking to the bed/kapton tape. It just squirts out plastic and that plastic ends up bunching around the head. Is this a Z-axis adjustment?

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

What did you change to get the extruder fixed?

If it isn't sticking, give the Z offset screw in the back a quarter turn counterclockwise.  Give it a quarter turn at a time until the first layer is flattened a bit but not squished.

http://solidoodletips.wordpress.com/201 … st-layers/

7 (edited by Caucasian 2012-08-18 17:25:20)

Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

Kept adjusting the tension, now it just does that 'popping' noise, but feeds more regularly. I don't remember it making that noise before, but if I let any tension off of the spring, it completely stops grabbing and feeds no filament.

The only way I can get the plastic to stick to the bed is if it is almost completely flat against it. I've tried the bed at 85, 100, and 110. No dice. I've used a dry cloth on the kapton a dozen times to make sure no oil was on it.

It still seems the feeding is the issue, it's like not enough is coming out, and so it is dragging some of it across...

I figured since they did a test print these things had to be calibrated already, I figured wrong.

I have no friggan idea what to do at this point.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

I have noticed the center of the bed is not level with the rest of the bed, which I think is part of my problem. The issue I run into now is that the way to level it is with your dial gauge, that I cannot print because the damn thing isn't printing...

The irony.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

You can try positioning the print nearer a corner of the bed.  It's small enough to keep away from the center.

You can get pretty close to level using a paper.  The dial gauge is good if you want to get the level down to +/- .05mm and get an overview of the level of the whole bed.  Paper is fine for prints with .3mm layers.

If blowing some extra air on the top of the hot end hasn't helped, the only other thing I can think of is to bump the temperature to 210 and see if the extra melting seems to help.  Don't go any higher than that, and don't leave at that temperature for long if it doesn't seem to be working.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

When you say level using a paper, what do you mean? I guess I missed that somewhere...

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bzAE5-QgUY

Move the nozzle near one of the front screws and put a piece of paper under it.  Raise the bed .1mm at a time until the nozzle barely starts to grab the paper when you slide it.  You might need to adjust the screw to get it just right, left to raise, right to lower.  Move the nozzle to the other front screw and do the same thing, adjusting only the screw this time.  When the paper seems to have the same amount of grip, move back to the first screw and double check it in case it moved a bit.

Once both front screws are at the same level, do the single one in the back.  You can turn the screw and slide the paper at the same time until it feels right, so long as you are careful to not press down with the hex driver while you do it.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

I finally leveled the bed, kind of nervous but I think I got it, it seems to be extruding a bit better as well (maybe just needed a break?) but the stuff STILL won't stick, not even to a 110 degree bed, even when "smooshed" down. I am baffled.

Any suggestions to try? Wiped off with a dry cloth, is there a better cleaning agent?

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

What should the thickness of the filament that is extruded be?

Mine is coming out (not against the bed, but out of the nozzle) at about .0235 inch or .6mm thickness.

Is that correct?

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

Mine is .38   I don't know if that is significant, I'm asking about it at the RepRap forum.   Is that the size you get extruding at 200C from pronterface with the speed set to 300mm/min?

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

A clean rag with some acetone in it is ideal for wiping the bed before prints.

16 (edited by ysb 2012-08-19 23:45:45)

Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

you can try this..  the idea is good..


Miracle Print Adhesion Improver hair spray
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:28787

http://thingiverse-production.s3.amazonaws.com/renders/3e/07/2a/3e/68/AguanetAdhesionImprover_preview_card.jpg

17 (edited by Caucasian 2012-08-23 00:07:48)

Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

Fixed!

Thanks to everyone for their recommendations. Turns out mine was one of the very rare cases where there was a clog. Never have this luck with the lotto...

John walked me through a few quick steps to fix it. The fix in this case was to agitate the blockage in the nozzle.

Beforehand it would only extrude a little, and seemed sluggish but having no real gauge to compare it to, I wasn't sure if it was enough.

Using a bristle from a stainless steel grill brush, and running it gently over with a bench grinder to remove burrs, I inserted it into the tip of the nozzle. Calipers said the bristle was 14/1000th. It was a very tight fit. I removed it after light jostling, manually extruded twice and it literally shot the offending material out (photo attached, no idea what it is for certain, appears to be non-metallic and is black) and FINALLY started extruding correctly. No more jumping in the extruder what-so-ever. It was obviously plugged just enough to hinder extrusion enough to screw everything to heck.

First successful print, at 15 minutes attached as well.

Thanks again for all the recommendations. It's running like a dream now. Off to print my mandatory Yoda bust now!

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

That's a good idea with the bristle.  I hadn't been able to think of something that would be small enough to fit in the nozzle while still being stiff enough to move anything around.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

I didn't have any guitar strings laying around, and I figure most people at least have a wire brush.

Thanks again for all the input and everything Ian, I'm pretty sure the Google Group and this forum would not really have half the headcount if it weren't for people like yourself who already know.

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Re: Prints not sticking/Extruder skipping

I'm glad you guys were able to work this out. We are still trying to figure out a better solution for clogged nozzles as well.

Former Solidoodle employee, no longer associated with the company.