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Topic: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

I just ran into an issue with my Davinci 1.0A. The heater just keeps heating up unless I turn the machine off or disconnect the heater harness at the back of the machine. This happens as soon I turn it on. It starts to heat the extruder.

The probem started when I brushed the nozzle as it was heating up. At first I got a decoupled error. I tested the little fuse and found that it had no continuity at all. So I soldered the whole thing. After that the heater just heats up as soon as I turn the printer on.

I reflashed it with repetier and that did nothing.

Does anybody have any suggestions.

My quick solution:
I was thinking of just adding a small adrunio board at the back of the machine. Solder 2 wires from the thermistor and feed to the back into a mini arduino. Program the arduino to shut off the power to the heater if the temp get high and mainaitn it.

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

Does anybody have any suggestions.

IMHO you need to troubleshoot the problem and repair it. Runaway heaters are the things of nightmare they are what burn down shops and houses.
sound like the thermistor is shorted out and therefore not sensing. the board has no idea of the overtempt therefore does not shut it down or control like it is supposed to.
I expect a hardware issue rather than software.

Soliddoodle 4 stock w glass bed------Folger Tech Prusa 2020 upgraded to and titan /aero extruder mirror bed
FT5 with titan/ E3D Aero------MP mini select w glass bed
MP Utimate maker pro-W bondtech extruder
Marlin/Repetier Host/ Slic3r and Cura

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

The thermistor shows accurate heat. It feels like the 12V supply is stuck open and keeps supplying 12 v as soon as the printer turns on. If I removed the bridge solder that I put across the broken fuse then I get no voltage at all wheater I ask the printer to heat up or not.

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

Sounds like the AD converter on the mainboard is shot then. You most likely shorted the 12 volts on the heater to the thermistor when you used the brass brush and this blew the input on the AD converter or input buffer. If you can identify it you could probably find it on Mouser and replace it. Otherwise your main board will need to be replaced. Might be a good time to consider a RAMPS 1.4 conversion.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

Would you know how to locate it and what to look for. I am thinking about just buying a new motherboard which currently runs at $80, which I can't afford. So this is fantastic...Can't use the printer for a while now. Does anybody have a motherboard they are willing to sell for a fair price or trade for some shop tools?

6 (edited by carl_m1968 2019-04-01 17:33:32)

Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

I have looked at some images of the 1.0a board and as usual with XYZ they try to have the processor do everything which means for us that can repair the boards it limits what we can do. In other words they have made it so the entire board has to be replaced to fix your little problem. Based on where the print head connects to the board at there are no IC's such as buffers or A to D converters between that connection and the processor. So all the input from the thermistor is handled by the processor.

Since you said the temp was showing and rising, I will now assume the temperature circuit is actually working and the issue is in the heater control. Which again could have been damaged by the short. Form what I can see in the image below the part I have outlined in red is the mosfet for controlling the hotend and most likely your issue. Form what I gather the part is a TPCC8067H.

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/To … bLaHJDI%3D


http://soliforum.com/i/?pYMEICl.jpg

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

7

Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

Here are some HD images I took about 2 Minutes ago. You can see my bridge blob. I can take more pictures if needed.

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

Here are the images:
http://soliforum.com/i/?9d93s6g.jpg
http://soliforum.com/i/?8QtTc0n.jpg
http://soliforum.com/i/?QFH0miT.jpg

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

In your images, Q1 is the part I circled and listed. That is most likely the problem with your board.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

10

Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

carl_m1968 wrote:

In your images, Q1 is the part I circled and listed. That is most likely the problem with your board.

Ok, I will see if there is a electronics shop around my town and see if they can repair it cheaply. Meanwhile I will see if I can test it with a multimeter and see if I can learn anything.

I know its a long shot, but if anyone can afford and is willing to buy the board off ebay for me and ship to me I'd be willing to send you a package of things as a Thank you once I get my financials straighten out. I can't afford $80 for a board. Here is the link:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/XYZ-printing-D … 4256678636

Thank you all fro helping. I will keep you posted with updates.

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

vela0050 wrote:

It feels like the 12V supply is stuck open and keeps supplying 12 v as soon as the printer turns on. If I removed the bridge solder that I put across the broken fuse then I get no voltage at all wheater I ask the printer to heat up or not.

FYI, on my 1.0A, the 12v to extruder heater IS always on.  On these printers, the heater and the fans, are ground switched so the power lines are always hot.  I tap that line at the extruder connector to run 12v fans with the normal fan grounds, so they can be controlled via gcode.  You should be looking at the ground line to the heater, which should have no connection until the heater it turned on.  So you might want to test that to make sure that something else isn't causing the heater to always be grounded.

DaVinci 1.0A with Repetier, mostly stock with some extruder mods.  Prints ABS, PLA, HIPS, PETG and Taulman Bridge.

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

FYI, on my 1.0A, the 12v to extruder heater IS always on.

I just want to be sure we are talking about the same source. the image below shows where I always get 12v. The other connections marked with x in the picture are always hot. The 12v that I have disconnected in the image, goes straight to the heating element and it is always hot. http://soliforum.com/i/?To8ymMG.jpg

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

I am going pretty crazy without my printer. It's been 4 days now that I haven't printed anything. I think I am going to start a gofundme to get the $85. Wow, being a millennial is just so great...either you have no money but have health insurance or have money but no health insurance. 4 days ago I would have never thought I would be begging the internet for a new Da Vinci 1.0 board to buy from ebay. Thank you all as always.

14 (edited by carl_m1968 2019-04-02 10:20:41)

Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

There is always power to the heaters. To control it they switch ground off and on using the MOSFET I referenced. That being said this MOSFET is shorted so ground is always applied.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

15

Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

vela0050 wrote:

I just want to be sure we are talking about the same source. the image below shows where I always get 12v. The other connections marked with x in the picture are always hot. The 12v that I have disconnected in the image, goes straight to the heating element and it is always hot.

Yes, that 12V you point to is always hot, as the heater is GROUND switched.  The misconception is that the printer turns 12v on and off, it does not.  As part of your troubleshooting, you should test for a ground short at the heating element first before replacing parts on your board (or getting a new board).  Note that on a stock extruder, the heating block is grounded, and ground will take any path including through the heater block to turn on the heating element.  Isolate the heating element and test for proper operation, then replace parts on your board if needed.

DaVinci 1.0A with Repetier, mostly stock with some extruder mods.  Prints ABS, PLA, HIPS, PETG and Taulman Bridge.

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

So I set this thing up. Used my Arduino Uno and a relay with a thermister on the Arduino to control the temp. Yup that did not work.
It heats up too fast and then has to cool down. The result is a +/-10C swinging nozzle temp. Way too much. I don't know how but 3d printers must have a gradual heating thing going on. It's not full 12v ON and then 0V for off. http://soliforum.com/i/?yV6Djf4.jpg

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

I know little about the davincici. the marlin OS firmware has two heating modes . PWM and bing bang aka on and off.

You do also have to have the correct themirisistors set as different  sensor have different temp curve. and then one need to tune the PID loop.

Soliddoodle 4 stock w glass bed------Folger Tech Prusa 2020 upgraded to and titan /aero extruder mirror bed
FT5 with titan/ E3D Aero------MP mini select w glass bed
MP Utimate maker pro-W bondtech extruder
Marlin/Repetier Host/ Slic3r and Cura

18

Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

Yeah I think I am going over to the Arduino Forum and ask them how to program the PID. Last night I got really close to getting the temp stabilized. If that does not work, I am just going to buy the MOSFET and attempt to solder it in myself. And if that fails I will get a new board. It might be time to get a new 2019 3d Printer if I can afford it. LOL. Thank you, everybody.

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

remember when testing modern electronics (Transistor era lol) dont use Simmons Meters or others like LED displays  that have 9v battery as that can burn out components.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

n2ri wrote:

remember when testing modern electronics (Transistor era lol) dont use Simmons Meters or others like LED displays  that have 9v battery as that can burn out components.

No offense, but what rock have you been hiding under? All modern DMM's are 9 volt powered.

I am a tech by trade specializing in Rectifiers for the telecom/wireless industry.. I repair rectifiers that take 240AC Single phase or 480 AC 3 phase and covert it down to -48 or -24 VDC at 20 to 200 amps. We only use Fluke 115 DMM's and those all use 9 volt batteries and we always test MOSFETS and other semiconductors with Resistance and Diode check functions and have never had a part damaged by a meter.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

21

Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

carl_m1968 wrote:
n2ri wrote:

remember when testing modern electronics (Transistor era lol) dont use Simmons Meters or others like LED displays  that have 9v battery as that can burn out components.

No offense, but what rock have you been hiding under? All modern DMM's are 9 volt powered.

I am a tech by trade specializing in Rectifiers for the telecom/wireless industry.. I repair rectifiers that take 240AC Single phase or 480 AC 3 phase and covert it down to -48 or -24 VDC at 20 to 200 amps. We only use Fluke 115 DMM's and those all use 9 volt batteries and we always test MOSFETS and other semiconductors with Resistance and Diode check functions and have never had a part damaged by a meter.

wink

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

I made it work!

I am using the Arduino with PID code to control a stable temperature I got it +/-2C which is way then before. Here is a tutorial I followed:
http://randomdamon.blogspot.com/2015/12 … ntrol.html

This guys PID values are OK, but it just overshoots slightly and crawls too slow to reach final temp.

Does anybody know how to get the original PID values from repetier?

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Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

vela0050 wrote:

I made it work!

I am using the Arduino with PID code to control a stable temperature I got it +/-2C which is way then before. Here is a tutorial I followed:
http://randomdamon.blogspot.com/2015/12 … ntrol.html

This guys PID values are OK, but it just overshoots slightly and crawls too slow to reach final temp.

Does anybody know how to get the original PID values from repetier?

There are no original values. They are different for every machine as every heater and thermistor combination will require different values. The base values simply get you in the ball park and can be found on any image of Repetier firmware from their download site.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

24 (edited by vela0050 2019-04-05 19:41:58)

Re: Help with heater constantly heating up to no end...

Here is the setup and code in case some else runs into the same issue.
http://soliforum.com/i/?bNoqh1p.jpg
http://soliforum.com/i/?rADGWZt.jpg

Arduino Uno Code:
#include <PID_v1.h>
// Analog output pin
#define outputPin 9
// thermistor analog pin
#define THERMISTORPIN A0
// how many samples to take and average
#define NUMSAMPLES 7
// how long between pid/sampling
#define SAMPLETIME 1000
//Define Variables we'll be connecting to
double Setpoint, currentTemp, Output;
//Specify the links and initial tuning parameters
PID myPID(&currentTemp, &Output, &Setpoint,9.06,0.66,31, DIRECT);
void setup() {
  Serial.begin(9600);
  analogReference(EXTERNAL);
  pinMode(outputPin, OUTPUT);
  //initialize PID setpoint *C
  Setpoint = 100; //This is the target temp you need. I have it set for 100C
  //turn the PID on
  myPID.SetMode(AUTOMATIC);
  myPID.SetSampleTime(SAMPLETIME);
  //pid Autotuner
}
void loop() {
  if (Serial.available() > 0) {
    // get incoming byte:
    Setpoint = Serial.parseFloat();
  }
  uint8_t i;
  double average = 0;
  // take N samples in a row, with a slight delay
  for (i = 0; i < NUMSAMPLES; i++) {
    average += analogRead(THERMISTORPIN);
    delay(10);
  }
  average /= NUMSAMPLES;
  currentTemp=resistanceToC(inputToResistance(average));
  myPID.Compute();
  analogWrite(outputPin, Output);

  Serial.print("Set Point: ");
  Serial.print(Setpoint);
  Serial.println(" *C)");
  Serial.print("Temperature: ");
  Serial.print(currentTemp);
  Serial.println(" *C)");
  Serial.print("PID output ");
  Serial.println(Output);
  delay(SAMPLETIME);
}
double inputToResistance(double input) {
  // funtion to convert the input value to resistance
  // the value of the 'other' resistor
  double SERIESRESISTOR = 10000;
  input = 1023 / input - 1;
  return SERIESRESISTOR / input;
}
double resistanceToC(double resistance) {
  // funtion to convert resistance to c
  // temp/resistance for nominal
  double THERMISTORNOMINAL = 118000;
  double TEMPERATURENOMINAL = 25;
  // beta coefficent
  double BCOEFFICIENT = 3950;
  double steinhart;
  steinhart = resistance / THERMISTORNOMINAL;     // (R/Ro)
  steinhart = log(steinhart);                  // ln(R/Ro)
  steinhart /= BCOEFFICIENT;                   // 1/B * ln(R/Ro)
  steinhart += 1.0 / (TEMPERATURENOMINAL + 273.15); // + (1/To)
  steinhart = 1.0 / steinhart;                 // Invert
  steinhart -= 273.15;   // convert to C
  return steinhart;
}