1 Topic by Active Andy

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Topic: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

Hi All,

I am new to this world so need a bit of advice. I am involved in conventional printing but want to expand in to other areas.

Looking to purchase a 3D Printer next year for my small business based in the US. Probably FDM that produces PLA parts (possibly other). 

My criteria (quite broad):-
1. Good speed to be cost-effective. I want to produce small batch runs of simple plastic parts but don't want to wait all day. Important.
2. Straightforward to use. Which CAD is best user-friendly?
3. Reliability, Repeatability and decent quality.
4. Budget $10-15,000 maybe more so Professional Machine or Entry Commercial.
5. Maybe 12 Inch Bed square +. Doesn't have to be big.

Better new or better value second hand? 
What machine is seen as the benchmark in this category?
I have had suggestions elsewhere of Leapfrog, Hyrel 3D and Minifactory Ultra?

It looks as if there are amazingly knowledgeable people on here so any thoughts and experience with your own machines would be really appreciated. 


Thanks in advance!

2 Reply by Tin Falcon

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Re: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

If you are looking to get a very nice printer give these guys a call

https://www.printedsolid.com/collections/3d-printers

The ultimakers are nice machines as are the raise 3d and the lulzbots.

For !2 grand you can get a top of the line ultimaker and a top of the lines raise 3d machine.
If you are serious  talk to these guy they really know there stuff and deal with lots of business customers.


Auto desk"s fusion 360 seem to be the current go to for cad and a bit more it is free for hobbist and start ups .

https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/ … n-360.html

Your business can make up to $100,000  per year to qualify for free use then it is IIRC $495 a year.

Soliddoodle 4 stock w glass bed------Folger Tech Prusa 2020 upgraded to and titan /aero extruder mirror bed
FT5 with titan/ E3D Aero------MP mini select w glass bed
MP Utimate maker pro-W bondtech extruder
Marlin/Repetier Host/ Slic3r and Cura

3 Reply by Tin Falcon

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Re: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

Good speed to be cost-effective. I want to produce small batch runs of simple plastic parts but don't want to wait all day. Important.

speed is not the major trait of current 3d printers yes some are faster than others there is a trade off between speed , resolution / nozzle size . This video explains it well.


Another reason to get two printers  for your budget
and you will need an assortment of  filament as well  figure $20 a kilo for regular pla  specialty stuff with powder fill will be a bit more.

Soliddoodle 4 stock w glass bed------Folger Tech Prusa 2020 upgraded to and titan /aero extruder mirror bed
FT5 with titan/ E3D Aero------MP mini select w glass bed
MP Utimate maker pro-W bondtech extruder
Marlin/Repetier Host/ Slic3r and Cura

4 Reply by heartless

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Re: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

2. Straightforward to use. Which CAD is best user-friendly?

CAD has very little to do with actual printer use.. this should be its own, separate category, not lumped in with the printer requirements
CAD = Computer Aided Design.

That said - what kinds of things are you looking to create?
mechanical/structural parts? (*see note below)
organic, life-like models?
What you want to make would dictate which program(s) i would recommend.

as for printers... well, that is a whole different ball game..

Leapfrog is definitely NOT something you want - it was designed with kids in mind.
Minifactory Ultra is set up for specialty materials = PEEK, Ultem, etc.. way more machine than what you need for printing PLA
Hyrel 3D - again.. way more machine than you really need - especially when you are just starting out.

My suggestion would be the PrintIt Industries offerings - https://www.printitindustries.com/colle … d-products
the 8-10 is the entry level machine, and is pretty basic.
the Horizon comes with full enclosure, a large touch screen & front loading SD card slot for easy use.


*Note..
If you are looking to make mechanical or structural parts - you do not want to do these in PLA.
PLA is fine for knick-knacks and shelf toys, but is not durable and is actually quite brittle & will break if dropped on a hard surface. it will also deform in heat (say something left in a car in the summer)
PETg would be a better choice, as would ABS, or a whole host of other materials.

What you are wanting to print - what the items use will be - is going to dictate what type of material you should be using.

SD4 #1 & #2 - Lawsy carriages, E3D v6, Rumba controller board, mirror bed plate, X motor fan, upgraded PSU & Mica bed heater
SD4 #3 - in the works ~ Folgertech FT-5, rev 1
Printit Industries Beta Tester - Horizon H1

5 Reply by Active Andy

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Re: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

Thanks Heartless and Tim. Some really useful feedback. Maybe you're right Heartless on machine type as really looking at straightforward novelty plastic parts (maybe up to 12 inches diameter not tall though more flat) to supplement my normal printing stuff. Not mechanical as such.

What do you guys think of Ultimakers, Lulzbots or Makergear? These are other machines I've heard mentioned.

Thanks again.

6 Reply by tonyno

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Re: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

I'll say this... A friend spent $2,500 on a LulzBot TAZ and I got an xyzprinting Da Vinci 1.0A for less than $400. He never got his working and I'm still going. Four years now...

It's more about what you put into it than how much you pay.

7 Reply by carl_m1968 (edited by carl_m1968 2018-12-28 01:12:32)

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Re: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

The question is  not "What is the best printer?" The question should be "What do I need one for and what do I plan to print?" You then find a printer that fills those needs with maybe some room for growth. If you don't plan to print daily then you might be better off going with a printing service. There are many services online now that are very reasonable that can print an object you design.

This is still a hobby and as such the printer will need maintenance and tuning all the time. There is no such thing as a 3D printer you just load and go. Every time you change filament you will need to do some tuning. So those are other things you need to take into account before you invest. You may prefer to pay somebody else to do the work for you on their machine.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

8 Reply by heartless

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Re: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

Active Andy wrote:

Thanks Heartless and Tim. Some really useful feedback. Maybe you're right Heartless on machine type as really looking at straightforward novelty plastic parts (maybe up to 12 inches diameter not tall though more flat) to supplement my normal printing stuff. Not mechanical as such.

What do you guys think of Ultimakers, Lulzbots or Makergear? These are other machines I've heard mentioned.

Thanks again.

mixed reviews on all of them, to be perfectly honest.

As tonyno mentioned - it is more about how much you are willing to invest your time & energy than about any specific brand of printer. I have built kit printers costing less than $400 that could print very well once calibrated & tuned. But it took time & effort to make that happen.

As carl mentioned, they do require tuning, tweaking, calibration, & maintenance on a regular basis.

you also need to learn how to use a slicing program, and all the various settings, and what each one does - and find one that you are comfortable with. There are plenty of those to chose from as well.

If you are not committed to doing all of these things - on an ongoing basis - then save your money and hire the print work done.

Now, all of that said, generally speaking - anything over the 8"x8" bed is kind of considered a "large format" printer.
larger sizes are becoming more common, with more options out there, but again.. do your homework. Research until you are sick of researching. Learn as much about a given machine as you possibly can from sources outside of the manufacturer - BEFORE you commit to buying... forums like this, facebook groups dedicated to specific machines.. there is gobs of information out there if one just looks for it.
Find out the strengths & weaknesses of the machine.. how much of a pain is it to calibrate, level the bed, etc.
Is it "open source" or "proprietary"? (< BIG difference between the two)

For the record - I do print work for others - https://www.facebook.com/northwoods3d/
I own 3 Solidoodle 4s, a Folgertech FT-5 large format and a PrintIt Industries Horizon.
Just recently traded my Folgertech Kossel for one of those SD4s. =P

SD4 #1 & #2 - Lawsy carriages, E3D v6, Rumba controller board, mirror bed plate, X motor fan, upgraded PSU & Mica bed heater
SD4 #3 - in the works ~ Folgertech FT-5, rev 1
Printit Industries Beta Tester - Horizon H1

9 Reply by Tin Falcon

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Re: Best Pro or Entry level Commercial 3d printer for small batch runs?

There is something to be said about investing in good equipment.
There is also something to be said about learning the equipment . Knowing how to adjust maintain etc.

If one does not know how to use a 3d printer  you have an expensive paper weight.
The local maker space has a u print it is IIRC 1 17-20 thousand dollar machine.  it is propriety so good luck getting or finding tech data on it.


IMHO for a business the Ultimaker , the lulzbot or the Raise 3d will be good machines. But they will need maintenance and adjustment.
the down side of the Utimaker is it uses 3mm filament  most others use 1.75

Do your homework . read users groups forums for each printer  before you buy.

Soliddoodle 4 stock w glass bed------Folger Tech Prusa 2020 upgraded to and titan /aero extruder mirror bed
FT5 with titan/ E3D Aero------MP mini select w glass bed
MP Utimate maker pro-W bondtech extruder
Marlin/Repetier Host/ Slic3r and Cura