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Topic: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

I've finally got my Press dialed in (I think, still figuring out slicer settings) and my first few prints fail after a bit. I started with the sample filament that it came with. Printed at Medium quality within Soleprint, and things were going pretty smooth until an hour in, and then the drive gear began "thumping" after 1 min of it, the filament stopped feeding through the nozzle and was eventually kinking the filament. I went through and tighten the set screw on the drive gear and retried printing the same print. The second one got 2 or 3 layers further but inevitably the drive gear "thumped" and the filament quit feeding.

Here's the two first prints:
http://soliforum.com/i/?ccnglJL.jpg

I decided to try a different print and see if I had any better luck. Short answer: no.

http://soliforum.com/i/?FpRkIGc.jpg

This one stopped at about the same "time" increment which was an hour into the print. I decided to try different filament. unfortunately I learned too late that Solidoodle has poor quality ABS, and ordered 5 spools of their stuff. Either way I need to try something else. So I'm gonna try a different spool and see what happens and report back. In the mean time I think I'm going to try Hatchbox's filament, anyone have any experience with their stuff?

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

daphur wrote:

I've finally got my Press dialed in (I think, still figuring out slicer settings) and my first few prints fail after a bit. I started with the sample filament that it came with. Printed at Medium quality within Soleprint, and things were going pretty smooth until an hour in, and then the drive gear began "thumping" after 1 min of it, the filament stopped feeding through the nozzle and was eventually kinking the filament. I went through and tighten the set screw on the drive gear and retried printing the same print. The second one got 2 or 3 layers further but inevitably the drive gear "thumped" and the filament quit feeding.

Here's the two first prints:
http://soliforum.com/i/?ccnglJL.jpg

I decided to try a different print and see if I had any better luck. Short answer: no.

http://soliforum.com/i/?FpRkIGc.jpg

This one stopped at about the same "time" increment which was an hour into the print. I decided to try different filament. unfortunately I learned too late that Solidoodle has poor quality ABS, and ordered 5 spools of their stuff. Either way I need to try something else. So I'm gonna try a different spool and see what happens and report back. In the mean time I think I'm going to try Hatchbox's filament, anyone have any experience with their stuff?

Watch your temp around the time it happens..

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

carl_m1968 wrote:

Watch your temp around the time it happens..

So far its going smoother this run with black SD ABS, no temp variance outside of +/- 0.30 degrees. I'm beginning to suspect the sample filament is the culprit.

4 (edited by daphur 2015-11-30 05:18:49)

Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

So I ran my 4th print in black SD ABS, it ran along further than previously however the drive gear began its "thumping" at the 1hour 20min mark instead. There was no variation in extruder temp.

Here is the failed print:

http://soliforum.com/i/?hLxHQpf.jpg

Out of the printer:

http://soliforum.com/i/?tr8529X.jpg

Here's a shot of the extruder, you can see the filament kind of kinked and jammed just beneath the gears (Tried to zoom in while in close, using crappy lens):

http://soliforum.com/i/?PZxRacY.jpg

High angle:

http://soliforum.com/i/?rOPxI01.jpg

I had a suspicion after the 2nd and 3rd print that its extruding too fast, and attempted to change the settings in slicer to lower all speed by 20-30% and the fill density up to 60%, however nothing changed after saving several times, not sure what happened there or if I missed a step after using slicer. Going to try my next print tomorrow in RH and see if I have any luck there.

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

If you take off the front of the extruder, has the filament thickened just as it enters the tube leading to the hot end? If so, the cold end of your extruder is too warm.

The usual suspects...

One common cause is having the fan suck from, rather than blow into the extruder. If your fan is the same as mine, it looks right. But check, in case they switched fan vendors.

Another cause is the anemic air flow from the fan. Did you run without the plastic shroud on the front? It's not just a finger guard - it guides the meager air flow though those vertical slots on the front to pick up a little more heat. So run with it on. It ain't great, but every little bit helps.

Some people run with top or front of the printer open a bit on long prints to help cool the extruder some. This is a mixed bag, as your model is less likely to crack with the chamber shut up.

Don't run the hot end any hotter than needed for good layer adhesion. Otherwise it increases the cooling load.

Also, if you're not getting thumping without buckling, consider turning down your vRef a smidge to, say, 1.4 volts. Less current means less heat from the motor to dissipate. (But if your stepper starts skipping, you went too far. It's a tricky balance.)

If you've ever diassembled the heater block from the tube, make sure it's not touching the bottom of the extruder body, as that will leak heat into the cold end of the extruder. (If you haven't, don't mess with it unless you need to.)

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

Going by his pictures it looks like the heat block is touching his extruders body. Is that normal for this printer? Normally there should be a visible tube which is a heat break between the hot zone and cool zone. I don't see any heat break in his images.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

trayracing wrote:

One common cause is having the fan suck from, rather than blow into the extruder. If your fan is the same as mine, it looks right. But check, in case they switched fan vendors.

I switched my fan around after the first print so it is blowing inward,

trayracing wrote:

Another cause is the anemic air flow from the fan. Did you run without the plastic shroud on the front? It's not just a finger guard - it guides the meager air flow though those vertical slots on the front to pick up a little more heat. So run with it on. It ain't great, but every little bit helps.

I removed this early on, I'm not sure if I still have it around, I'll have to check

trayracing wrote:

Some people run with top or front of the printer open a bit on long prints to help cool the extruder some. This is a mixed bag, as your model is less likely to crack with the chamber shut up.

I'm trying this with my next long print

trayracing wrote:

Don't run the hot end any hotter than needed for good layer adhesion. Otherwise it increases the cooling load.

Haven't yet figured out the golden temp for SD ABS, I've been running at 240 degrees. maybe too hot?

trayracing wrote:

Also, if you're not getting thumping without buckling, consider turning down your vRef a smidge to, say, 1.4 volts. Less current means less heat from the motor to dissipate. (But if your stepper starts skipping, you went too far. It's a tricky balance.)

Are you talking about the extruder trimpot? its set at 1.5v

trayracing wrote:

If you've ever diassembled the heater block from the tube, make sure it's not touching the bottom of the extruder body, as that will leak heat into the cold end of the extruder. (If you haven't, don't mess with it unless you need to.)

I've not yet disassembled the heat block

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

carl_m1968 wrote:

Going by his pictures it looks like the heat block is touching his extruders body. Is that normal for this printer? Normally there should be a visible tube which is a heat break between the hot zone and cool zone. I don't see any heat break in his images.

I have some gap:
http://soliforum.com/i/?tWb5C2H.jpg

9 (edited by daphur 2015-12-01 04:16:47)

Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

Also these are my current slicer speed settings for "medium" quality:

http://soliforum.com/i/?3GB6oMX.jpg

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

Hi Daphur,

Yes I meant lowering the extruder trimpot voltage a little from 1.5v, if your extruder motor is hot.

As for temps, lower is better as long as layers bond well. It varies a bit from machine to machine and filament to filament. Even different colors (or even batches) from the same manufacturer can differ. I run 230-235, but I'm not running SD filament. If the thermistor has shifted in the heater block, it can also read differently. Also, if you've replaced your thermistor, some model thermistors have a different response curve and will run the printer much hotter for the same set point.  At a very gross level, if your printer reeks when printing, and the resulting part smells a bit burnt, the extruder is definitely too hot.

The gap above the heater block in your picture looks good for a Press.

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

As I'm attempting to figure and sort out the issues, it seems others arise. I was able to get a successful print done, however it was smaller than the previous prints, so it may have not been solved initially. I moved onto a larger print when for some reason my computer was shut down via the power strip (either the dog or a child) in the middle of a print. It was looking like it might have been a good print but i had to reset everything and attempt again. however every print following afterwards with the exception of Z-Calibrations, it was printing like the bed was too close to the extruder causing the nozzle to scrape and drag the first print layers.

Here is the first print after the shut down:
http://soliforum.com/i/?6NOQkDl.jpg

So I rehomed everything cleared the glass with a bit of acetone and lay down some glue. Z-calibration and tried again. Same exact result. (Thinking I might have forgot to select which run was best) Performed another Z-calibration this is the result:

http://soliforum.com/i/?wxxq2gW.jpg
Another angle
http://soliforum.com/i/?hLkjDdC.jpg

Feel like I should stick with where its at 3.90 and run it again. If it still scrapes along, not sure what to do. Probably going to lower that extruder trimpot like suggested by trayracing and go from there.

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

If the Press is anything like the Solidoodle 4 that I have, 240C sounds high even for ABS. Because of the location of the thermistor, Solidoodles notoriously read much lower than the actual temperature. If you are running too hot, the machine will run fine for a while. After a certain amount of time the extrusion rate will not be able to keep up with the amount of plastic being melted. The resulting back pressure can cause failed prints because the pressure is so high inside nothing can come out. When this happens, it may not be able to advance the filament and thus giving you the thump.

Just a hypothesis to check if nothing else is working. I usually have to run ABS at about 200-205 degrees to get good prints.

Solidoodle 4-Mostly stock running off headless Raspberry Pi with Octoprint

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

Morganism wrote:

If the Press is anything like the Solidoodle 4 that I have, 240C sounds high even for ABS. Because of the location of the thermistor, Solidoodles notoriously read much lower than the actual temperature. If you are running too hot, the machine will run fine for a while. After a certain amount of time the extrusion rate will not be able to keep up with the amount of plastic being melted. The resulting back pressure can cause failed prints because the pressure is so high inside nothing can come out. When this happens, it may not be able to advance the filament and thus giving you the thump.

Just a hypothesis to check if nothing else is working. I usually have to run ABS at about 200-205 degrees to get good prints.

I feel like the opposite was occurring, the filament was getting fed too fast and it wasn't hot enough. I've dialed in some slower settings in slicer and kept the top vented open and its been printing without major issues. For some of the earlier immediate failed prints I was flipping the models along the Z or Y axis within Soliprint to print without having to add supports (since I'm still fairly new to printing, and haven't figured out those settings yet). and the prints weren't "meant" to be printed on the side I put them on.

I'll report back in a bit. I'm currently on my 3rd successful print, I'll show my slicer settings when done.

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Re: Filament breaks after 1 hour.

I am not sure but seems to me there was something in the earlier press posts about running at 250 due to strange temp reporting of the nozzle.

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