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	<title type="html"><![CDATA[SoliForum - 3D Printing Community — Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
	<link rel="self" href="https://www.soliforum.com/feed/atom/topic/14301/" />
	<updated>2016-03-18T00:54:22Z</updated>
	<generator>PunBB</generator>
	<id>https://www.soliforum.com/topic/14301/speed-bottleneck/</id>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119476/#p119476" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Please note travel speed is not the same as print speed. </p><p>My travel speed in s3d is set to 100 mm/s and I have had no issue with that. I haven&#039;t tried higher but to be honest travel speed will only minimally affect your build time since for the majority of your print its not performing travel moves.</p><p>Travel speed is how fast it will move when not extruding and does not really affect the quality of your layers as long as you are not loosing steps it doesn&#039;t matter what you travel speed is.&nbsp; However fast travels can knock parts off </p><p>For print speeds which is what we have been talking about&nbsp; I think your software Extrusion speeds is what you want to compare. </p><p>Sorry I don&#039;t know the maker bot software so I am not 100% sure on that but I know in slicer and in cura wen used in repetier you have printing speeds and travel speeds and no they are not the same thing.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[mark.burton]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/10955/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-18T00:54:22Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119476/#p119476</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119475/#p119475" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>here is the factory settings for my Makerbot 2x.<br />as you can see standard travel speed is 150mm/s<br /><span class="postimg"><img src="http://soliforum.com/i/?sgnjEaL.jpg" alt="http://soliforum.com/i/?sgnjEaL.jpg" /></span><br /><span class="postimg"><img src="http://soliforum.com/i/?oeVcJj3.jpg" alt="http://soliforum.com/i/?oeVcJj3.jpg" /></span></p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[dubbsd]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/187/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-18T00:29:25Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119475/#p119475</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119464/#p119464" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>There are a few factors that are going to affect the print speed,</p><p>The first is desired accuracy. No mater what printer the faster you print the less accuracy you will have.&nbsp; This can to some degree be over come by the design of the machine and what hardware you have.</p><p>Cartesian machines are&nbsp; simpler to set up and generally will have very easily and reproducible accuracy but will be slower then delta machines.</p><p>Delta machines are generally faster&nbsp; but are more complex and have more sources for introducing inaccuracies.</p><p>core xy machines are a hybrid between the delta and Cartesian machines so are in general more accurate then the delta machines while being slightly slower however they are generally faster then Cartesian machines but are also less accurate </p><p>The type of drive will also affect speed. Bowden can usually be faster since you have less mass. this makes it so you don&#039;t need as powerful motors, you usually have less acceleration and deceleration issues, and usually less harmonics.&nbsp; However you&nbsp; also have more of a limitation on what materials you can print and the some slippage in the press fit connections which affects the accuracy of the extrusion.</p><p>Direct drive has less material restrictions (for a well built extruder) is more accurate in extrusions and retractions but has more mass so you have issues with acceleration and deceleration which usually means you have more harmonics. </p><p>Note as you ramp up speed with stepper motors you run into a greater chance of missed steps due to inertia of the hardware and the stepper motors being unable to produce the needed torque. the torque also drops off the faster you move so at top speed you have 70% of the rated torque.&nbsp; so you can use more expensive motors that have more torque but realize this also requires a stepper motor and stepper driver that can handle the increased power requirements.</p><p>So speed will really be about the same in most cases since they hardware used is generally speaking nearly the same.<br />Some of the higher end machines are more expensive due to tighter tolerances and better/stronger hardware and that can affect your top speed.</p><p>So if you have better liner motion tolerances from linear rails and trucks, these being better then case hardened rods and linear bearings which are again better then rods and bronze bushings you can go faster due to better rigidity.</p><p>Next your looking at the motors these can be stronger motors or even more accurate motors (.9 deg per step vs 1.8 deg per step stepper motors) and better stepper drivers . Most printers use stepper drivers that can give 16 microsteps&nbsp; but there are ones that can support 32, 128, or 256.&nbsp; Some of your high end drivers can support up to 5 or more amps which allows for more powerful stepper motors. Most hobby level stepper drivers can support 1.5 to 2 amp</p><p>Another thing to look at is the extruders a better extruder design will allow for faster prints as well</p><p>Also a lot of high speed printers are using larger nozzles&nbsp; say .6 .8 or even 1 mm.&nbsp; however this does give you less accuracy </p><p>Again it always comes down to accuracy vs time&nbsp; more accuracy is all ways going to take longer but hardware and software can and do make a difference as well</p><p>I have seen a video where some one tune their davinci up just right to print at 90mms but he has to keep up on the maintenance and make sure everything is just right. he does not recommend that setting for most people he has it set as a top speed for most people at 70 mms and I think that is a bit ambitions in general for these machines</p><p>With a stock davinci I don&#039;t think you will get good results above 60mms without some work.</p><p>Any way that&#039;s my take on it.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[mark.burton]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/10955/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-17T22:26:49Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119464/#p119464</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119458/#p119458" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>So bottom line question here:&nbsp; either with the stock head, or E3D V6, is The DaVinci capable of printing ABS at speeds comparable to more expensive printers?&nbsp; If not, is the quality lost on those more expensive printers going that fast not worth the ability to do so?</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[Telemachus]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/13355/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-17T19:09:32Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119458/#p119458</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119455/#p119455" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Those speeds are usually measured based on the largest nozzle the machine will except an only printing a single straight line.</p><p>They will print one line of a fixed distance then using the time that took, they use some fuzzy math to come up with an average mm per second.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[carl_m1968]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/7731/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-17T17:55:20Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119455/#p119455</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119444/#p119444" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Taz 5 and the like claim 100-200mm/s max speed.&nbsp; Is that theoretical, and in reality the results at that speed would be poor?</p><p>I can&#039;t imagine additive machines like these could really go that much faster without some drastic change in the technology.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[Telemachus]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/13355/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-17T15:59:33Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119444/#p119444</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119423/#p119423" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>mark.burton wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>hmm I have been printing at 60 mms I tried 70 but it was a bit unreliable at the at speed but 60mms works fine.<br />I am even able to print flexible at that speed now.</p><p>However when I am printing something with intricate details then I slow it down to 30 to 20 mms.</p><p>A lot of times ill try it at the fast speed and then if I have issues slow it down.</p></blockquote></div><p>Is that with the Bondtech extruder ?</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[scobo]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/6872/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-17T07:05:47Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119423/#p119423</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119422/#p119422" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>I had been printing at 30 mm/s since I first got the machine, with first layer at 25 mm/s.</p><p>I have been toying with 50 mm/s for the last two days and am happy with the results and time savings.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[Telemachus]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/13355/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-17T07:01:34Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119422/#p119422</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119396/#p119396" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>mark.burton wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>hmm I have been printing at 60 mms I tried 70 but it was a bit unreliable at the at speed but 60mms works fine.<br />I am even able to print flexible at that speed now.</p><p>However when I am printing something with intricate details then I slow it down to 30 to 20 mms.</p><p>A lot of times ill try it at the fast speed and then if I have issues slow it down.</p></blockquote></div><br /><p>When I said 20mm or slower I was talking about items with fine detail or .1 or less layer heights. When I print normal at .3 I usually print at 45 to 50mm.. I am not doing production at this time so time is not an issue and my printer runs while I do other things so it is not like it is costing my time on other things either so speed is not a concern of mine.</p><p>Honestly instead of speeding up and pushing your machine to max and wearing it out sooner to reach schedules you should consider more machines to meet schedules..</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[carl_m1968]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/7731/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-16T22:53:26Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119396/#p119396</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119393/#p119393" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>hmm I have been printing at 60 mms I tried 70 but it was a bit unreliable at the at speed but 60mms works fine.<br />I am even able to print flexible at that speed now.</p><p>However when I am printing something with intricate details then I slow it down to 30 to 20 mms.</p><p>A lot of times ill try it at the fast speed and then if I have issues slow it down.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[mark.burton]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/10955/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-16T22:09:56Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119393/#p119393</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119365/#p119365" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>I don&#039;t go much above 30mm/s, even with repetier and an E3D.<br />With flexible filament, the most I can go to without problems is 10mm/s. That&#039;s mostly down to the limits of the stock extruder gears.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[scobo]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/6872/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-16T06:19:44Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119365/#p119365</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119350/#p119350" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>20mm/s wow, I&#039;ve been printing a lot fast than that, lol.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[Telemachus]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/13355/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-15T20:34:22Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119350/#p119350</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119340/#p119340" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>No matter the printer, talking about FFF cartesian types here. If you want really fine detail you will see and use speeds of 20mm/s or less typically.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[carl_m1968]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/7731/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-15T17:52:53Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119340/#p119340</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119336/#p119336" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Its always a trade off less speed is more precise so when going for a higher quality part or if something is really delicate slow it down.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[mark.burton]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/10955/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-15T16:44:57Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119336/#p119336</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Speed Bottleneck]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://www.soliforum.com/post/119299/#p119299" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Using suggestions from others I have found (slow) speed settings in slicer that give me quite decent results on my stock 1.0A repetier 0.92.</p><p>Just out of curiosity, must the da vinci print slow for good results with stock hotend?&nbsp; Is extruder stepper motor the main bottleneck, or the motors on the x/y axes?</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[Telemachus]]></name>
				<uri>https://www.soliforum.com/user/13355/</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2016-03-15T06:04:03Z</updated>
			<id>https://www.soliforum.com/post/119299/#p119299</id>
		</entry>
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