76 Reply by maaltan (edited by maaltan 2016-02-23 16:54:23)

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

for this last set, i seemed to have to really crank the tension down to get the gear to grab. it is possible it is too high. On that note how do you determine the right tension? Every guideline I've seen just say play with it until it works.  What works when extruding with manual controls, doesn't when you do real prints.   

Hmm idea.  i should write up a bit of manual gcode to emulate extrusion during a print (slow extrusion followed by quick retract/extrude for anti-ooze.  Repeat 5-10 times to test the tension?  would back-pressure at the nozzle be something i need to account for?


  The motor does get quite hot, but not really burning hot though. The dust never seems to show signs of melting so i assume the print wouldn't be warping?  The fan on the extruder stepper heatsink is a bit sick, i have to flick it a couple of times when i first turn it on to get the bearing to seat right and stop buzzing.  It has never stopped and it does pull a lot of air.

the build chamber usually runs about 50C.

-edit- 

So, perhaps the collapsed bearing is a symptom not a cause as some have been suggesting.  Perhaps my nozzle is a bit clogged causing excessive backpressure. (plastic extrudes straight, but i have a real difficult time manually pushing plastic through it, sometimes fracturing the filament. )  therefore i have to add excessive tension which causes parts to warp and/or the filament to sheer causing the chain reaction.

I did disassemble my hotend to get the wood piece off. perhaps i a piece of the peek broke loose when i screwed it back end partially blocking things upstream from nozzle.    I will try to examine it tonight.  I am thinking of giving it a good cleaning via acetone injection.  it seems acetone dissolves peek so i will have to separate again.

77 Reply by wardjr

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

Sounds like you may be dealing with a partially clogged nozzle and are trying to compensate at the expense of other parts.  I shouldn't be that difficult to extrude.  What temp are you extruding ABS at?

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78 Reply by AZERATE

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

Can you double check the bearing you have installed? It should say something like 625 or 625zz
The dimensions should be 5 deep x 16 wide x 5 inner diameter. I saw in one of your earlier posts the bearing read "China", but all my stock Solidoodle bearings read 625zz. Perhaps the original owner replaced it with an incorrect bearing?

As for tension, you only want enough to allow the teeth to grip the filament. It's ok to have some tooth marks, but too much will compromised the filament and cause odd behavior in the extruder in certain circumstances

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79 Reply by maaltan

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

wardjr wrote:

Sounds like you may be dealing with a partially clogged nozzle and are trying to compensate at the expense of other parts.  I shouldn't be that difficult to extrude.  What temp are you extruding ABS at?

195c according to stock hotend thermocouple.


AZERATE wrote:

Can you double check the bearing you have installed? It should say something like 625 or 625zz

I am original owner,  it is stock.  I will double-check.  I ordered it in the middle of the solidoodle 2 media crush, so I kind of expect shortcomings.  I did order some extra bearings while i was studying how to attack the jigsaw.  i will go ahead and replace the bearing as well in case it is intermittently binding.

80 Reply by wardjr

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

That is a little cold on a stock hot end, should be closer to 205 - 210.
There is nothing wrong with the dimensions of that bearing from what I can see.  The location of the bearing is actually changing and I am guessing the cause is way to much tension on it, forcing the bearing to push below the drive gear instead staying in line with it.

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81 Reply by maaltan

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

I was looking at the "cold pull cleaning" method.  i found roughly an equal number of webpages touting that "<x> is the best plastic for this" where x = [ ABS, PLA, Nylon]

Any opinions on here?   I am going to attempt ABS first since i have it and I cant see it hurting anything.  I also have PLA, but it has metallic dust in it so I'm wary of using it for this purpose.  Would some cheap 1.75mm nylon trimmer line be advisable to try for this?

Again, thanks all for your help so far.

82 Reply by maaltan

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

Quick probably dumb question.  Those bearings I mentioned I purchased...

They are  covered( inside the ball track also it seems) in a heavy sticky resin or grease.  This makes them way too stiff to use in this application.

Am I supposed to soak then in a degreaser or something?  The closest thing I can find on Google to match this description is cosmoline on new guns which requires manual scrubbing

If I am going to have to disassemble them to make them usable,  I may just take
Them back.

83 Reply by AZERATE (edited by AZERATE 2016-02-24 04:50:10)

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

We actually sell high quality 625zz bearings here
http://www.printitindustries.com/collec … l-bearings
It is not uncommon for bearings to be shipped soaked in oil to a certain extent, but it is not sticky at all. It would be safe to assume the stuff is inside the housing with the bearings, so I would recommend returning them if you can get your money back.

If you choose to order from us and would like us to make you an MK5, we would be happy to accommodate. Shoot us an email on the Contact page and we will work something out for you.

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84 Reply by maaltan (edited by maaltan 2016-02-24 23:45:57)

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

Disassembling and cleaning the hotend...fun...  wait I mean that other word.

Does the solidoodle extruder really feed 1.75 filament into a 40mmX3mm melt chamber (the brass barrel)?  or.. did I accidentally dissolve something I shouldn't have with acetone?  If so, no wonder the cold pull cleaning did nothing.

this E3d and its 2mm melt zone should be amazing comparatively. (Should be on the "boat" to the US now)

edit:

Well game over for now... the brass barrel can take zero torque.  The videos online show people removing things by hand.  Solidoodle must have thread locked mine (there was a black crumbly substance in the peek/brass junction with similar black crumbly substance coming out of nozzle threads.).   The second break was me trying to unscrew it hot.

http://soliforum.com/i/?QXGhmHV.jpg


Since my printer is destroyed at the moment, I decided to experiment with the bearings. I made the assumption that the sticky substance was a cosmoline like substance.  Apparently it is common on Asian manufactured mechanics that are shipped via cargo boat (even smalll bearings like these)

I loaded my ultrasonic parts cleaner with 50% really hot water and 50% simple green.  My cleaner has a heater so i turned it on as well.   I ran it for 5 minutes then rinsed them in clear water. I dried them to best my ability then placed them in a small glass container and sprayed a good helping of WD-40 to displace the remaining moisture. 

Since my cleaner is for water only, I sit the glass container and used the old dirty water as a conductor (because i was lazy.  and it was already hot) and ran it for another 5 minutes.  the WD-40 turned milky which i assume means it was emulsifying water. (see picture below).  after that ran, i dumped the old WD-40, wiped them down and repeated.  this time the wd-40 stayed mostly clear.

http://soliforum.com/i/?TsNXMfc.jpg

I removed the bearings from wd-40 bath, wiped them down again and gave them a good dose of all purpose oil, rotating each a bit to get good penetration.  They spun pretty well, but all purpose is kind of heavy for this purpose. they spun at least as good as my old one.  You could probably get a freer spinning bearing with a penetrating dry lubricant (like for bike chains)

85 Reply by maaltan

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

I have the acrylic enclosure "finished".  i still cant find a suitable dome/party tray/etc.  I pieced what i have together with scraps from lowes (cost $3 instead of $20.. they still cut it to size for me smile ).

Still waiting on E3d hotend...

I wonder if there would be any hope in soldering the old hotend barrel back together? (a little googling says probably not.  regular solder melts at 183ishC.   silver/hard solder at 190-195c.   So..I'm guessing ill have a spectacular blowout if i attempt it.)  Unfortunately, google also killed my next idea:  Printing with solder.  Ignoring lead toxicity, the solder is much more conductive to heat.   By time you melt the tip a large section of the incoming solder will be wobbly and/or liquid.  Even with the E3d micro melt zone.  Also the solder will erode brass parts.

86 Reply by heartless

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

yeah, no... you wont be "fixing" that hotend. best to just sit tight and wait for the new one to arrive.

But, why on earth would you order an E3D from overseas when it is readily available here in the states?? (my guess is it isn't even a real E3D, but a clone)
You can even get one fully assembled now - all you have to do is make the connection to your board, install at the extruder and flash the firmware with the correct thermistor table...
http://www.printitindustries.com/collec … -assembled

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87 Reply by maaltan

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

Wardjr told me to in my real "extruder upgrade" thread. wink  (sorry got those intermingled about 30 posts ago).

I purchased directly from e3d-online.  There were so many questionable sites out there overtly or secretly selling clones, i didn't feel like taking a risk.  Also exchange rates were in my favor last week so it was actually about $5 cheaper.

That said, i read somewhere that filistruder is an official reseller.  I have not verified this, but they had something that looked like a real e3d on their page.

http://www.filastruder.com/collections/ … -v6-hotend

88 Reply by AZERATE

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

There are a few Genuine resellers in the US. Filastruder, Makerfarm, PRINTiT, etc.

Printit Mason and Printit Horizon printers
Multiple SD2s- Bulldog XL, E3D v5/v6/Lite6, Volcano, Hobb Goblin, Titan, .9 motor, Lawsy carriages, direct Y drive, fishing line...the list goes on
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89 Reply by wardjr

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

FYI: @maltaan, PRINTiT is a site that myself along with AZERATE, jagowilson & IronMan started to serve the community.  I can assure you we are a genuine E3d reseller supplied via Filastruder (US Distributor).  We just weren't open at the time you were looking to buy your E3d.

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
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Thanks to all for your contributions

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90 Reply by maaltan

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

quick reply...

Whooh.. e3d showed up. I got it together, mounted, and wired with little trouble.  Printed a calibration box at reasonable tolerances. I have some questions and pictures, but I'm going to move back to my extruder upgrade thread..


http://www.soliforum.com/topic/13714/so … r-upgrade/

91 Reply by maaltan (edited by maaltan 2016-03-07 21:32:04)

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

A extruder breakdown post-mortem...


I have been thinking about where i went wrong with the extruder upgrade.. lets address this by individual problems


1: The bearing/tension arm collapsing on lawsy mk5.

I am thinking this was caused, as mentioned before, by having to much tension on the tensioning arm.  After disassembling (err destroying) my stock hotend I have come to the conclusion that it was not clogged.  I measured the test extruded filament  and it was measuring .42mm.  Accounting for die swell, it seems that the .35mm nozzle was not obstructed. 

So why the excess tension? 

I believe this was because i was printing at 195c as mentioned by Wardjr.  A historical note: this is the recommended temperature coded into the solidoodle provided profiles, as well as the default temp mentioned in all of their troubleshooting literature.  This worked great with the jigsaw extruder and i never had any kind of problems.  Also they said never go above 220c because the hotend will explode.  That said, there are statements floating around that the thermistor was measuring up to 30c cooler because of its external mount location.  Maybe this is valid?  I would guess it is hard to prove either way.

Therefore, my conclusion is the Lawsy mk5 provides less clamping force before it fails than the acrylic jigsaw.  My prints were at 75% fill.  Maybe higher fill can match the jigsaws clamping force?  Unfortunately, i killed my stock hotend before i could eliminate these possibilities.

It is all kind of a moot point since the e3d V6 i installed requires a small fraction of the extrusion force of the stock.  From my personal experience, i would have to recommend planning on upgrading the hotend asap when moving to a Lawsy.


2: Deep cleaning the stock extruder.

Personally, I would have to say just say no... i spent several hours soaking in acetone and prodding with various wires and utensils to get it mostly clean.  Based on my experience, I would have to say if you cannot unscrew the peek barrel from nozzle assembly by hand then give up. the brass barrel is too fragile.  I am pretty much convinced that solidoodle started threadlocking the extruders at some point.  that or my connections were just leaky causing plastic to seep into the threads and carbonize producing the same effect.

92 Reply by SpaceCowboy850 (edited by SpaceCowboy850 2016-05-04 15:41:02)

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

I'm about to start this project as my stock extruder was having issues.

I have had my solidoodle 2 for about 3-1/2 to 4 years now.  It has mostly worked.  I did a mod to make direct y-drive work when I had the belt slip, and I've updated the firmware (marlin) once a few years ago to try to get better 0.1mm precision.  That's the extent of my mods/expertise.

But recently I ran into an issue while printing a case for my jetson TK1.  The footprint was 5x5ish, so nearly covered the whole bed.  It took several tries to print the bottom, and that is when I got my first clog.  I was able to clear it out, but then found that sometimes the filament was not feeding through.  I tightened the thumbscrew, thought I had fixed it, as the bottom printed out, but when I went to print the top of the case, again, filament stopped extruding (the ball bearing stops turning, while the extruder motor keeps going).

I then tried to see if I needed to unclog the hot end, so I attempted to remove it.  I think the acrylic was already cracked, but in trying to remove the hot end, I finished the job.  sad

So now I'm in the process of figuring out what parts I need to replace the extruder.  From the E3D thread, I've landed on this:
http://www.filastruder.com/products/all … -v6-hotend
http://www.filastruder.com/products/law … solidoodle

But then I have a 12V, 10A stock power supply, so I thought I might as well upgrade that as well.  So I'll be picking up this:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00D7C … CUniversal

as well.

This wiki
http://www.soliwiki.com/Upgrade_The_Power_Supply
I have soldered before, but I'm pretty shit at it, so hopefully nothing here requires soldering.

Question regarding power supply:  It says I'll need 16 guage wire.  Will this work?
http://www.amazon.com/Gauge-Black-Stran … +conductor

I was thrown by the "THIS IS NOT AWG AMERICAN WIRE GAUGE" statement, which I don't understand.

Also let me know if there is anything I'm missing.  I plan on following the above wiki for the power supply upgrade, and this one to upgrade the extruder:

http://www.soliwiki.com/E3D_extruder

I'm a bit nervous as I'm not experienced with modding/electronics (more a software guy), but this is a lot cheaper than buying a MakerGear M2 (at least at the moment - that is my backup plan if this fails).

I miss my 3D printer.  sad

93 Reply by wardjr

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

I think it's great that you are looking to buy from Filastruder.  We may be able to save you from multiple orders if you are buying a PSU and other items.  Filastruder is our supplier and I would ensure that we make things right with Tim for those items you'd otherwise buy from him.  Here's a link to the store that a few of us from community started just for situations like yours.
http://www.printitindustries.com/
Regardless of where you order from, we are here to help.

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94 Reply by SpaceCowboy850

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

Do you know when you'll get the E3dv6 12V assembled in stock?

Also, if I get this power supply and add a plug, do I still need 16 gauge wire to do the power supply upgrade?

http://www.printitindustries.com/collec … wer-supply

95 Reply by wardjr

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

I'm checking on that now, it usually isn't very long.

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
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SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

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96 Reply by wardjr

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

As for the 16 guage wire, yes you will need something to go from the PSU to your board.  What board do you have?

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
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Thanks to all for your contributions

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97 Reply by wardjr

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

Sounds like they are in stock so go ahead and order even though it says "out of stock". 
As for wire, just let me know what you need.  I am sure we can get what you need.  If you have a Printrboard and need a barrel connector you can either cut your existing cord or we also have barrel connectors and wire in stock.

Printit Industries Model 8.10 fully enclosed CoreXY, Chamber heat
3-SD3's & a Workbench all fully enclosed, RH-Slic3r Win7pro, E3D V6, Volcano & Cyclops Hot End
SSR/500W AC Heated Glass Bed, Linear bearings on SS rods. Direct Drive Y-axis, BulldogXL
Thanks to all for your contributions

wardjr's Website

98 Reply by SpaceCowboy850

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

I have a Sanguinololu circuit board.

So it sounds like I'll need:
Power Supply
   http://www.printitindustries.com/collec … wer-supply
Plug for the new Power Supply
   http://www.printitindustries.com/collec … 5201274694
16 Guage wire for the Sanguinololu (not sure where that is)
   Not sure where this is on the store, or how to order it?
Mk6 Extruder Housing for the E3Dv6 - assuming printed parts only, since I can use the screws/springs from my existing broken one.
   http://www.printitindustries.com/collec … 6-extruder
E3Dv6 12V
   http://www.printitindustries.com/collec … -assembled

Wardjr, if that sounds right, let me know, and I'll put those in the cart and purchase.  Also let me know what to do about the wire.

Thanks!

99 Reply by AZERATE

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

That looks like the full shebang!

However, since you have a Sang, the plug is not needed. So that saves you some cash. 16g braided wire is easily accessible at Ace Hardware or Home Depot if you have one near you. If not, contact us at [email protected] and we can work out an agreement to include extra wire lengths.

Printit Mason and Printit Horizon printers
Multiple SD2s- Bulldog XL, E3D v5/v6/Lite6, Volcano, Hobb Goblin, Titan, .9 motor, Lawsy carriages, direct Y drive, fishing line...the list goes on
Filawinder and Filastruder #1870.....worth every penny!

100 Reply by SpaceCowboy850

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Re: Solidoodle 2 upgrades

Update 1:  Power Supply upgrade was a success.

Only word of advice is that I thought black was universally a "negative" wire, but Solidoodle had put the black in the positive connection, so it confused me that my power supply seemed to be working when I used the multimeter on it, but the Solidoodle wouldn't fire up when connected.

As a last resort I flipped the connections and it worked.

Also the default way solidoodle clamps onto the wires sucks.  When I originally got mine a few years ago, one of the power connectors had disconnected.  I now see that it seems like the way it screws in just doesn't hold the wires very tight.