51

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

I need one bed, I'll send you a pm..

Check out my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/icanthinkofanid

52

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

I just installed mine.

I tried the cork Method, but I found that I had some issues calibrating. I think it may be because the clamps pushed the cork in more, so the corners were lower than the center. (Using a dial indicator to calibrate.)

I ultimately decided to file down the plastic tabs like tedh98 did and everything is up and running.

53

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

I really didn't want to have to modify the printer to install the glass.
I've just received some samples of 3.3mm glass and it fits fine without any shims.
I've also increased the width and length by a fraction more. The sample is 8.23" and I had 1.5mm gap if I push it to one side.
I ordered new glass at 8.26" which leaves about 0.7mm for manufacturer tolerance.
Hopefully they will be here 3/16/15 to 3/20/15.

James

54

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

Understandable about not wanting to mod the printer...

I am well past that point as I have changed to using rep .92, and made some adjustments to the case anyway, next steps are to change to a bowden setup because the direct drive extruder is heavy.

55

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

That sounds like a project!
My delta uses bowden and I like it. You're right. the head is super light and can move quickly.
Would be interested in photos etc when you have it working.

James

56

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

My glass is getting looser and looser but it's still prints just fine. It just bugs me to see it constantly shifting around.

Once I get off my lazy ass, I'll take the time to secure it properly...

Win 8.1
Improved Da Vinci 1.0 with Firmware 1.2.5 and stock extruder
Arduino cartridge resetter and after-market ABS filament
TinkerCAD, Netfabb, Simplify3D

57

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

Do you still have spare replacement beds?  If so How much for shipping and the part to Wyandotte, MI 48192.  It seems that XYZ Printing is still out of replacement parts.

58

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

Hey James,  I am interested in picking up the new setup from you.  I should have the funds on the 27th.  Do you think you will have any available at that time?  Also, how much with shipping to Benton, AR 72015?

Thank you for your time and offering such great alternative.  Cant wait to replace my chipped glass with this one

-Dustin

59

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

@CaptChaos.
Shipping would be $8.26 for a total of $58.26 Paypal me at james (at) holbrookmechanical dot com and I'll get that in the mail pronto.

@gethammboned.
I've got about 25 left with more on the way. Should not be a problem for the 27th. Shipping is $5.84 for total of $55.84

@Pseudoshooter.
I've got the heat resistant shims. No shrinkage and they fit perfect. PM me your address and I'll drop a set in the mail.

Little update.
I noticed that my heaters were not going on as well as they were previously. I could not get them flat no matter how carefully I applied them. Always ended up with one or two little spots.
I contacted the manufacturer and was informed that the glue is hygroscopic. It absorbs water! Why he didn't tell me that in first place.. I don't know.
Anyway. I've setup a sealed container with desiccant to keep them from absorbing water.
Over the weekend I experimented with heating the heater to try and remove the water. After about 6 failures$$$ I found that 7 minutes in a 170F oven and they apply perfectly again.

Waiting on the OK for the duo glass I sent to the tester. Heaters are on the way for it. Should be a few more weeks.

Thanks

James

60

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

Hey guys I just wanted to bump this and vouch for this guy to those thinking about purchasing. I went ahead and ordered mine with heater installed because my old glass was developing a concavity in the center that I couldn't shake.

-Very good communication outside of the Soliforum PM system (I miss lots of PM's due to not getting a notification).
-Fast shipping, same day I Paypal'ed.

Arrival!
http://i.imgur.com/c3geToFl.jpg

Great packaging
http://i.imgur.com/2GpWKjol.jpg

He includes 2 zip ties and 4 cardboard riser pads
http://i.imgur.com/Xtqunycl.jpg

Packaged glass
http://i.imgur.com/feUFB53l.jpg

Old (top) and new (I installed my own Kapton. It was shipped bare glass with heater installed)
http://i.imgur.com/Lz5Apd2l.jpg

Installed with the riser pads. Prints great!
http://i.imgur.com/K4N0Ez1l.jpg

Bonus outdoors shot of new glass with heater
http://i.imgur.com/3KnQCMnl.jpg

I'm impressed with the product and the jdholbrook33. I will keep you guys posted on long term performance to see how this pans out against the old bed.

Thanks jd!

Repinci 1.0 + Repetier host

61

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

Paypal sent! smile

62

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

jdholbrook33 wrote:

Gluing the heater to the glass also assures even heating of the glass.


I too noticed the free hanging wires of the thermistor and heater supply. During assembly of my Da Vinci I kept looking for something to tie wrap the cables to the Z frame. Seems the wire bundle is only supported by the connection to the printed circuit heater.
My cable hits the cleaner box on the way up and down. The connector for the thermistor is going to catch on that tray I'm sure of it.
May be worth it to drill a hole in the webbing of the z axis frame and tie wrap the cable bundle out of harms way and supported.


James

I did exactly that on one of my 1.0's since the constant flexing on the hot film will eventually break the wire solder pad. Maybe that is why XYZ graciously offers only a 90 day warranty on that part.

I do feel good though that the center screw for the removable shipping plastic retainer of the carriage is fully covered by the 1 year warranty, that is a huge relief.

63

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

Can you do a postage cost to the uk for me?

jdholbrook33 wrote:

It's been some time since I posted in the forum. In that time I have had some problems with my pancreas and it's kept me from going forward with my 3D printing.
Now that I've semi recovered I was able to get back to my pet project.
Both of my Da Vinci printers have problems with the glass. One is cracked up the middle after much flaking of the glass, the other is going the same route with flaking on each print job.

I wanted to find a borosilicate glass to replace the original. A call to XYZPrinting and request for warranty replacement was met with "For the heated bed, we sell the whole Z-axis platform with the bed and it is priced at $100.00+tax(if applicable)+shipping."
Considering that the printer was just a few months old, I thought they would replace it under warranty.

Anyway...
After much digging and phone calls I have the solution.
I have the original heater (new upgraded version) and good quality (Borofloat) borosilicate glass for the Da Vinci. I went with the 2.75mm thickness as that matches the original.
So it's a plug and play solution.
Just disconnect the heater at the back, pull the wires out, unscrew the brackets holding the old bed, drop in the new bed, attach the bracket, route and connect the wires and calibrate. Viola!

If you're interested I have about 18 sets left.
I'm asking $45 for the glass and heater unassembled or $50 for the assembled version.
Plus shipping of course.

I have thoroughly tested them and found that the new heater is a little faster to heat up and parts pop off the glass much better than the original glass.

If this post is inappropriate, let me know and I'll remove it.

James

64 (edited by mpoffo 2015-03-29 21:06:48)

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

I guess I am joining the club.  When I was done with my latest print I noticed that parts of the glass where stuck to the print after a full cool down.  I just submitted my ebay order.

DaVinci 1.0A with Repetier .92
Simplify 3D
E3DV6

65 (edited by demick 2015-03-30 01:19:20)

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

Well, it happened again. I have the borosilicate glass and heater from James. I was very happy with it. The parts always stuck nicely and popped off much easier than the original glass. But I ran a medium size part overnight. The next morning the part was done. The part was already popped loose just from the cooling process, but there were 2 thin pieces of glass (about 1 square inch each) that had also 'popped loose' too.  Of note: I have been printing directly onto the glass (no tape or anything). I guess I'll need to use tape or something in the future. I really wish there was a solution for separate glass and heater, as I would not mind changing the glass when it chips, but at $60 a pop for glass/heater it is expensive. This one lasted about 35 hours of printing. About half as long as the original. Anyone else have the same problem?  Is it recommended not to print directly to the glass?  Would like a long term solution.

66

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

demick wrote:

Well, it happened again. I have the borosilicate glass and heater from James. I was very happy with it. The parts always stuck nicely and popped off much easier than the original glass. But I ran a medium size part overnight. The next morning the part was done. The part was already popped loose just from the cooling process, but there were 2 thin pieces of glass (about 1 square inch each) that had also 'popped loose' too.  Of note: I have been printing directly onto the glass (no tape or anything). I guess I'll need to use tape or something in the future. I really wish there was a solution for separate glass and heater, as I would not mind changing the glass when it chips, but at $60 a pop for glass/heater it is expensive. This one lasted about 35 hours of printing. About half as long as the original. Anyone else have the same problem?  Is it recommended not to print directly to the glass?  Would like a long term solution.

It has never happened to me, but I always run a sheet of Kapton just for this reason. I ran it on my stock glass as well as my borosilicate glass before first heat up. Sorry this happened!

Repinci 1.0 + Repetier host

67

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

rockosmodlife wrote:

It has never happened to me, but I always run a sheet of Kapton just for this reason. I ran it on my stock glass as well as my borosilicate glass before first heat up. Sorry this happened!

Just wondering why you replaced your stock glass.  Did it still chip even with the Kapton tape?

68

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

demick wrote:
rockosmodlife wrote:

It has never happened to me, but I always run a sheet of Kapton just for this reason. I ran it on my stock glass as well as my borosilicate glass before first heat up. Sorry this happened!

Just wondering why you replaced your stock glass.  Did it still chip even with the Kapton tape?

No, I replaced it because it developed a concavity at the center that was crippling my print quality no matter what I did to try and "average" my bed height. If it calibrated around the spot, the center often wouldn't stick. If I calibrated with the spot in mind, I would get back-pressure and clicking. I eventually settled on splitting the difference but I didn't like the overall quality and decided to go with the new glass. I have not had an issue with glass chipping off- with or without Kapton. I saw a post on here a long while ago about some pretty nasty glass chips and decided that the 15 bucks for qty 10 Kapton sheets was worth it for piece of mind.

Repinci 1.0 + Repetier host

69

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

demick wrote:

Well, it happened again. I have the borosilicate glass and heater from James. I was very happy with it. The parts always stuck nicely and popped off much easier than the original glass. But I ran a medium size part overnight. The next morning the part was done. The part was already popped loose just from the cooling process, but there were 2 thin pieces of glass (about 1 square inch each) that had also 'popped loose' too.  Of note: I have been printing directly onto the glass (no tape or anything). I guess I'll need to use tape or something in the future. I really wish there was a solution for separate glass and heater, as I would not mind changing the glass when it chips, but at $60 a pop for glass/heater it is expensive. This one lasted about 35 hours of printing. About half as long as the original. Anyone else have the same problem?  Is it recommended not to print directly to the glass?  Would like a long term solution.

I had the same thing happen twice with borosilicate glass so I now use a separate plate on top of the glass bed and the heat
transfer works just fine.
Got rid of the stock metal hold down setup and made some plastic hold downs.

I still use blue painters tape most of the time.

I had some ABS from Filament Outlet that printed great but would not release from the boro glass even after cooling 24 hours and then
a chunk of glass would come with it.

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Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

leenanj wrote:

I had the same thing happen twice with borosilicate glass so I now use a separate plate on top of the glass bed and the heat
transfer works just fine.
Got rid of the stock metal hold down setup and made some plastic hold downs.

I still use blue painters tape most of the time.

I had some ABS from Filament Outlet that printed great but would not release from the boro glass even after cooling 24 hours and then
a chunk of glass would come with it.

Good information. Thanks.  I may try the glass over glass approach.  I'm just using the standard XYZ filament with factory settings.  Strange thing is that all other parts I have run have popped right off of the borosilicate glass with almost no effort (unlike the stock glass to which parts could really get stuck).  So it doesn't make much sense to me why the glass would have chipped like this because the culprit is normally too much adhesion between the part and the glass.

71 (edited by MasterCATZ 2015-03-31 04:16:36)

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

one thing I have been woundering is has anyone tried adding another sheet of glass ontop that just sits onto the bed

or anything else that could be used to prevent the glass issue happening during plastic cool down time ?

*edit* and the message abouve this post mentions it tongue

ROFL

72

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

Some interesting info: Thermal expansion of borosilicate Glass is 1/2 to 1/3 that of regular glass.  Thermal expansion of ABS is very similar to regular glass.  So it would make sense that ABS sticks just as well to borosilicate glass as regular glass - just that when they cool, the difference in thermal expansion between the ABS and borosilicate glass breaks the bond between them.  Since ABS and regular glass have similar thermal expansion rates, the ABS remains stuck to the glass even after cooling. This would explain why the parts come off of the borosilicate easier after cooling.  But there is probably no difference in how well it sticks when hot.  Also might explain why the regular glass chips when trying to remove a stuck part.  Borosilicate chips during the cool-down process.  In either case the chipping happens when the part is being broke loose from the glass.

73

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

demick wrote:

Some interesting info: Thermal expansion of borosilicate Glass is 1/2 to 1/3 that of regular glass.  Thermal expansion of ABS is very similar to regular glass.  So it would make sense that ABS sticks just as well to borosilicate glass as regular glass - just that when they cool, the difference in thermal expansion between the ABS and borosilicate glass breaks the bond between them.  Since ABS and regular glass have similar thermal expansion rates, the ABS remains stuck to the glass even after cooling. This would explain why the parts come off of the borosilicate easier after cooling.  But there is probably no difference in how well it sticks when hot.  Also might explain why the regular glass chips when trying to remove a stuck part.  Borosilicate chips during the cool-down process.  In either case the chipping happens when the part is being broke loose from the glass.

http://www.titaniumteddybear.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/carl-sagan-dude-what.jpg

Regular glass has a linear thermal expansion coeff. of about 9x10^-6 m/m K
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/linea … -d_95.html

Acrylonitrile Butadiene Styrene has a linear thermal expansion coeff. of about 73.8x10^-6 m/m K
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/linea … -d_95.html

Not to mention that the glass is well below the hot-end temperature when printing ABS.

Repinci 1.0 + Repetier host

74

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

MasterCATZ wrote:

one thing I have been woundering is has anyone tried adding another sheet of glass ontop that just sits onto the bed

or anything else that could be used to prevent the glass issue happening during plastic cool down time ?

*edit* and the message abouve this post mentions it tongue

ROFL

I had a local glass company but me  piece of tempered the sam size as stock but 6 mm thick. It mounts perfectly under the tabs on top of the existing glass. I have been running mine for two months now like this with no issues. Heats to 110 with no issue either.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

75

Re: Da Vinci borosilicate glass with heater

rockosmodlife wrote:

Regular glass has a linear thermal expansion coeff. of about 9x10^-6 m/m K
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/linea … -d_95.html

Acrylonitrile Butadiene Styrene has a linear thermal expansion coeff. of about 73.8x10^-6 m/m K
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/linea … -d_95.html

Not to mention that the glass is well below the hot-end temperature when printing ABS.

Doh! Good catch. I think the table I looked glass up on was expressed in 10^-7 and I didn't pay close enough attention. I guess I can toss that theory out the (plain) glass window!