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Topic: Moulding/casting?

Heya guys,

Looking for some advice on how I'd go about moulding a model starship that I've been very slowly preparing.
I'm having some problems visualising how I'd go about creating a suitable multi-part mould... Thinking perhaps it would be necessary to chop the struts with the nacelles off from the main body and mould them separately?

http://i.imgur.com/SLnLbgX.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/bhnS2MX.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/gUriQlR.jpg


Cheers for any advice!

This is a crowd funding thing that I'm running: http://www.gofundme.com/bvi140 It's for pretty selfish reasons tongue

2

Re: Moulding/casting?

I agree with chopping off the drives, along with their mounts, and doing them seperately.  It could be done in one piece but you would have much less trouble with trapping air in three pieces.  The other two sections should be easy peasy!

Bowden SD3, Rumba, E3D hotend, Mk5 with RtRyder changes, Direct drive Y axis and bearings, GT2 pulleys and braided fishing line, Lawsy linear bearing conversion, M3 Z screw.

3 (edited by n2ri 2014-11-24 08:41:05)

Re: Moulding/casting?

the mount arms could stay on main body using only a 2 part rubber mold for body (top/bottom) also if seperated at same spot flush to surface of plasma drives and using a slot in drives with tenon on ends of supports to fit in slots (like how other parts need for assembly). a mold of a single drive unit could be used and just do 2 pores/injections (which ever method/material used for casting the identical drives.
I have made several silicone rubber molds for small detailed items and try to make as few molds or multi parts of mold as possible to do the job. also rubber molds have a use life of limited times or years of use b4 they deteriorate beyond use for good castings. (some may be a few hundred uses within say 5 years depending of materials used and storage condition or how hard removal of casting is on high detailed models) but if you save masters then making new molds are easy, especially for small parts in multi model spin casting molds. the better quality and durability the masters are. the longer you can continue delivering a casting. some I have seen produced for decades if popular sales. but many only have a run of maybe a couple dozen b4 demand bottoms out.

plastic injection or cast items are cheapest way next to epoxy or mixed chemical poors. I like the durability of alloy metals best.

now molding rubber requires metal die molds due to heat of material being pored or injected then allowed to cool but unless mold gets burned or damaged by mistake some how or improper storage conditions that can harm/carode the metal then these molds can last over 100 years use like iron sand cast molds etc. so depends what your planning for items being molded.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

4 (edited by n2ri 2014-11-24 08:57:56)

Re: Moulding/casting?

if casting with molten metal and not spin casting then you need to make the funnel hole at 1 end of molds and clamp mold halves together and have them either turned on edge like the old Gilbert Kaster or Lee metal molds, or laid flat with funnel end tilted up near 45 degrees so material flows in while letting air bubbles escape. use a coating of mold release like talc powder or soot on mold halves for metal casts. also after testing you may discover thin parts needing weep cracks for air to get out so it pores full. if so then silicone rubber molds are easy to do this. use a razor blade and make a shallow slit from those spots to the funnel hole (if larger areas are in the path then you can stop the slit at that point and air will seek its own escape). just dont damage mold integrity with these slits.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

5

Re: Moulding/casting?

accusedmonk wrote:

I agree with chopping off the drives, along with their mounts, and doing them seperately.  It could be done in one piece but you would have much less trouble with trapping air in three pieces.  The other two sections should be easy peasy!

+1 on the separation of the struts...

@Serin, what casting material will you be using?

@n2ri,

Wow...that's a lot of info on molding...I have not yet tried this but would consider for some of my projects; can you post some pics or examples of the venting techniques you described in your post?

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

6

Re: Moulding/casting?

Cheers guys!

Ironman, I'll probably just be using a polyurethane. Something fairly simple like SmoothOn.
So in turn it seems logical to just use a standard silicone moulding material of some form in a two part per piece set up.

N2ri, danke, that's a bucket of info!

I'd actually thought about splitting the main hull thing down the middle and laying it on the flat for moulding. But again, very unsure.

Hmmm indeed!

This is a crowd funding thing that I'm running: http://www.gofundme.com/bvi140 It's for pretty selfish reasons tongue

7

Re: Moulding/casting?

Also, you have to take into account the flexibility of the silicone mold.  I'm using smooth on's oomoo 30, it has quite a bit of stretch which really helps with more complex geometries.

It's not impossible to do a one piece, you just have to make sure you vent it properly. If you haven't made one yet, go here and watch these videos. They will probably give you a few great ideas on how best to make your mold!

http://www.smooth-on.com/media.php

Bowden SD3, Rumba, E3D hotend, Mk5 with RtRyder changes, Direct drive Y axis and bearings, GT2 pulleys and braided fishing line, Lawsy linear bearing conversion, M3 Z screw.

8

Re: Moulding/casting?

IronMan wrote:
accusedmonk wrote:

I agree with chopping off the drives, along with their mounts, and doing them seperately.  It could be done in one piece but you would have much less trouble with trapping air in three pieces.  The other two sections should be easy peasy!

+1 on the separation of the struts...

@Serin, what casting material will you be using?

@n2ri,

Wow...that's a lot of info on molding...I have not yet tried this but would consider for some of my projects; can you post some pics or examples of the venting techniques you described in your post?

near impossible to see the slits with camera unless mold is flexed to open them up like a flesh wound. main thing to remember on planet earth, gravity is our friend. air rises and metal falls, making it easy to vent. I also dust talc into slits while flexing mold b4 using mold then as in every prep with talc knock molds upside-down on table to get excess off and out of details. just dont over do vents too deep so metal etc dont seep out, also dont chop pieces out of mold. injection molds and most spin molds wont need vents as air will be forced out mold edges and maybe tiny amounts of casting material. since I was a kid I have been collecting and using all types of toys that make other toys and some even recycle left overs or failed castings. I call them 'molding/maker toys' many I have created new custom molds for using a jig I made to fill bottom half with silicones then coat master object with release like 'Pam' spray or thinned Vaseline and pushing master into silicone then I made a funnel plug that slides through side of jig til touching master, set it aside where it wont be disturbed till cured (some silicones take 5-7 days for this) then I use single edge razor blade to carefully trim around master to proper level for halfway point of mold (mine has a thin lip with guide holes at corners to hold it in toy caster) then apply same release agent posted above over entire top surface of mold and master b4 added plenty more silicone on top then place top of jig over it lining up with the 4 corner guide pins with pre determined depth so I can press them tight together smushing out excess silicone and set aside as b4 to cure, then carefully slice all oozed silicone flush with outside of jig and very carefully pry the 2 halves apart, remove jig parts and clean mold halves while removing master. then see if anything needs repaired like filling in any bubbles in silicone etc. after new mold is all set dust with Talc test a cast to see if vents are needed then re-dust with Talc and use.
  now this is my low temp alloy non-toxic casting stuff (melts at 174f) and the jig is made of smooth wood and impregnated with hot wax (looking for chucks of nylon or teflon to make multiple jigs of. and I use silicone like in calking or tubes mostly clear for seeing defcts better. if using lead or hotter them the vulcanized silicone mix must be used and its not as flexible but same processes but cured faster in oven or chemically.

as for pics I am gathering that for my other topic on 'art form' also listing all forms of manufacturing I do. plus when my son can work me into his videography schedule (side job) I am going to make some youtube info videos also. as these are fast becoming forgotten. nobody gets rich with these so keeping it secret is just nonsense.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

9

Re: Moulding/casting?

Here's an informative video on 3D print to casting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWVVSZP3Au4

Printit Mason and Printit Horizon printers
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10

Re: Moulding/casting?

AZERATE wrote:

Here's an informative video on 3D print to casting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWVVSZP3Au4

Ok, I'd heard about using PLA in that manner, but damn that was cool to watch. Worth it just for the robot dance.

Actually, had a thought.
If I built a clay base that came up to approximately half of the main body with the drives still attached could I not just make the mould like that? The model is exactly (cm) 13.966w x 39.5d x 6.806h so the strength of the poly shouldn't be that much of an issue.

Dunno, at this point I'm still just thinking out loud.

Thanks for the advice, people.

This is a crowd funding thing that I'm running: http://www.gofundme.com/bvi140 It's for pretty selfish reasons tongue

11

Re: Moulding/casting?

Serin wrote:

If I built a clay base that came up to approximately half of the main body with the drives still attached could I not just make the mould like that? The model is exactly (cm) 13.966w x 39.5d x 6.806h so the strength of the poly shouldn't be that much of an issue.

Sorry, not visualizing what you're describing...my mind CAD must need more RAM (or another cup of coffee) smile

Can you post a quick rendering of the clay base?

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

12

Re: Moulding/casting?

Basically just this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ1A7ZjTsx8

Visualising is indeed an annoying thing to do tongue

This is a crowd funding thing that I'm running: http://www.gofundme.com/bvi140 It's for pretty selfish reasons tongue

13

Re: Moulding/casting?

Serin wrote:

Basically just this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ1A7ZjTsx8

Visualising is indeed an annoying thing to do tongue


but how would you get mold material to fill under overhangs? then how would you remove model without destroying mold?

I will try to post some pics of my smaller stuff tomorrow maybe it will help. been busy with all the 'Ferguson' stuff going on near me watching my back etc.

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs

14

Re: Moulding/casting?

Serin wrote:

Basically just this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ1A7ZjTsx8

Visualising is indeed an annoying thing to do tongue

Serin, Great video...Thanks!

I would still think you would at least need to split the model at the nicelle struts (on the main body) and use a mortise and tenon + glue arrangement to connect them after molding.

Will be nice to see n2ri's examples...

SD2 - Stock - Enclosure - Heated Bed - Glass Plate - Auto Fire Extinguisher
Ord Bot Hadron - RAMPS 1.4 - Bulldog XL - E3D v6 - 10" x 10" PCB Heated Build w/SSR - Glass Plate
Thanks for All of Your Help!

15

Re: Moulding/casting?

this is link to my Topic started b4 this one about things I do including this. so I will be adding to my topic so I have more control of it not being deleted plus relevant things.

http://www.soliforum.com/post/73125/#p73125

Solidoodle 2 with Deluxe kit cover & glass bed with heater. and 2nd board SD2 used not 3rd and alum platform not installed yet still wood. also need cooling fan installed to board. use Repetier Host couple vers. Slic3r also have all free ware STL programs