1 (edited by tonycstech 2015-08-28 07:31:51)

Topic: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

http://soliforum.com/i/?JLH5TE8.jpgAfter upgrading my cooling fans to "DELTA 40x40x15mm AFB0412SHB 2 Pin" ($5 + $2 shipping on ebay) i got so much air blow that drove me into conclusion that my printer now "BLOWS" get it ?
Yes its noisy but very effective at bringing my E3D V5 hotend down to a freezing point.

I attempted to redesign the fan mount so it would overlap the hot end by some to shield it from blast of air but that quickly failed because some parts would blast the air straight up and from all sides allover.

So i thought: Hmmmm INSULATION ?
I used aluminum duct tape and fiberglass insulation roll piece by piece wrapped around the hotend.
The tape glue stinks as it heats up (i suspect all sorts of toxic fumes come from that tape sticky side), so clearly its not the ideal way, but i already ordered another insulation tape from ebay and will give it a go very soon.
I will also try to wrap another hotend i have (from China, but aren't they all from there ?) with that yellow tape (kapton)

Results are AMAZING !!!!!! (so far with fiberglass and alum tape)
Hotend temperature is more stable. It heats up faster.
Because i can have 2 fans blow at 100%, PLA cools down instantly making the print as perfect as it could get (with what i have)
Print quality has jumped from good to gooder !
Allot of difficult areas of the print are now getting done easier with less artifacts and nearly perfect result.
Overhangs and bridges. Open holes are not nearly as problematic as before. (not a big fan of support print)

Print speed was at 50mm/s and u could go 70 but i needed as much accuracy as i could for this part.
Slight drip at the very top (see picture) but not as bad as before.

Keep in mind that this is a 100% solid print and its not warped and has no pealed off corners anywhere. Its as straight as it should be.
http://www.soliforum.com/misc.php?action=pun_attachment&item=9116&download=0&secure_str=6792t12161

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2

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

This picture revealed something even i didnt expect.
There is a gap in the design, but earlier prints would smear things around making it solid.
New print is far better in its precision and reveals the gap that would otherwise not be there due to filament expansion that is nearly eliminated with much of a BLOW.
http://soliforum.com/i/?zxLae8C.jpg

Over all, i am very pleased with the results and from now on, i will insulate all my hotends.

3

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

I like it, I have always had something on my hotend for insulation but I haven't tried the aluminum duct tape. I have some in the basement. I will have to give it a try.

SD3 w/ mods:
Glass bed with QU-BD heat pad upgrade, threadless ballscrew w/ 8mm smooth rod, spectra line belt replacement, lawsy MK5 extruder, Lawsy replacement carriage, E3D hotend, Ramps 1.4 w/ reprap discount controller, DRV8825 drivers, 12v 30A PS, Acrylic case, Overkill Y-idlers, Filament alarm, Extruder fan + more.

4

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

Dont. I have a very good feeling that fumes are toxic.
Unless you have tape without adhesive.
http://soliforum.com/i/?V8haL3y.jpghttp://soliforum.com/i/?dfnu1Xw.jpg

Gotta find something better then this.
Maybe wrapping fiberglass with KAPTON tape instead of aluminum duct tape ?
Should work fine, but i still going to try different tape specifically designed for high temperatures.
I'll get it next week.

5

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

<voice style="old curmudgeon"> 'Way back in the day, </voice>

Back on the Makerbot Cupcake, they wrapped it in ceramic tape. I bought spare strips back then from Makergear (they still have a photo of some in the 2nd image here, but are at least out of stock if not completely discontinued.

They also have "Expandable Rubber Coated Fiberglass" in tubes that slip over a hotend.

Don: Folger Tech 2020 Kossel Rev A + Borosilicate + Snow Effector
        Davinci 1.0 + Repetier : Filastruder
        SD3 + RAMPS + Lawsy Carriages + E3D + Borosilicate + ... : Cupcake

6

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

They sell pre cut ceramic fiber kits on ebay for this very purpose. You just wrap then tape with kapton.

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

7

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

carl_m1968 wrote:

They sell pre cut ceramic fiber kits on ebay for this very purpose. You just wrap then tape with kapton.

You mean this ?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/T10Si-Upgrade-k … 4621e6f672
Its too expensive for printed part. I'd buy it if it was molded and had my E3D hotend listed as "fits"

Looks like the KAPTON tape over fiberglass works just as good, but i dont like the mess created with fiberglass and its dust is kinda dangerous if it gets into your eyes or on your hands.
http://www.soliforum.com/misc.php?actio … 6792t12161

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Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

tonycstech wrote:
carl_m1968 wrote:

They sell pre cut ceramic fiber kits on ebay for this very purpose. You just wrap then tape with kapton.

You mean this ?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/T10Si-Upgrade-k … 4621e6f672
Its too expensive for printed part. I'd buy it if it was molded and had my E3D hotend listed as "fits"

Looks like the KAPTON tape over fiberglass works just as good, but i dont like the mess created with fiberglass and its dust is kinda dangerous if it gets into your eyes or on your hands.
http://www.soliforum.com/misc.php?actio … 6792t12161

Actually I meant these but there are also some other variations if you modify your search terms.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/MakerBot-Replic … 3aafcd02b8

Printing since 2009 and still love it!
Anycubic 4MAX best $225 ever invested.
Voxelabs Proxima SLA. 6 inch 2k Mono LCD.
Anycubic Predator, massive Delta machine. 450 x 370 print envelope.

9 (edited by tonycstech 2015-09-01 07:56:12)

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

OK here i tried this tape i ordered and it sucked. It smelled so weird it was making me sick.
I guess KAPTON and fiberglass is the way to go.
It has been proven to work for few prints already and is easier to remove in case  what ever.
http://soliforum.com/i/?4SZ3yfM.jpg

10

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

I had some FG tape somewhere but never got around to installing it. Huh, guess I should - looks like it's very worthwhile.
Thanks for the informative post, tony.

SD3. Mk2b + glass, heated enclosure, GT2 belts, direct drive y shaft, linear bearings, bowden-feed E3D v5 w/ 0.9° stepper
Smoothieboard via Octoprint on RPi

11

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

I've been doing this for probably years on all my hotends.

Use any kind of fiberglass, wrap it around and use PET or Kapton tape to tie it together. Thicker you get fiberglass there the better!

As for cooling prints, i've used a quite powerfull 80x80mm fan for as long, PLA, Nylon and EVEN ABS at times, but depends on printer, you need to go REALLY fast (150mm/s+) on prints and HOT (250-270C). Not all printers are capable of that.

Also insulate the bottom of your heatbed, with good cooling of parts the usual heatbeds are having hard time to reach temps unless bottom is insulated.

Baking paper (!!) - yes, that stuff you use on the oven for the pizza you just made, turned out to be better insulator than fiberglass, but being lazy i have not redone heatbed insulation.
Put many layers of baking paper and tape all the seams - what happens is that it traps tiny amounts of air in there, and ambient air is actually an insulator when it isn't allowed to move! wink

You can top it of with some fiberglass sheets, and the finally coat it all around with duct tape.

DEI Cool tape and aluminium tape are pretty much the same, they work only for radiative heat and in convection actually are conductors of heat since it's aluminium. Gold works even better, you can get the cheap emergency blanket type and glue that together where you would use aluminium.

You can get nice cheap woven fiberglass which doesn't itch from the fire extinguishing blanket smile those are same stuff.
Another source is FRP materials, they use woven fabric fiberglass as well.

12 (edited by tonycstech 2015-12-07 06:52:56)

Re: Insulated HotEnd is a GOOD IDEA !!!!

After months of using fiberglass i tried ebay for "reprap hot end cotton insulation"
Works much better. It work so well i cant even compare it to my old ways.
http://soliforum.com/i/?9TkeYjh.jpg
It absolutely does not react to 2 30mm cooling fans when they blow at 100%. Fiberglass insulation was not anywhere near as effective.
It worked so well i ordered sheets of that insulation to wrap my FILASTRUDER caz its kinda cold these days and its struggling to keep the temperature stable.

I keep my bed cool for PLA. It sticks to blue tape better when its cool and comes right off when done.
PLA also does not shrink if you cool it fast, otherwise its no better then ABS which i avoid as much as i can due to its warping issues that i cannot control even with hot bed. But thats my own printer issue rather then ABS its self. My printer is open so entire environment is cooling and thats a disaster for ABS as it likes a more gradual cooling rather then quick.